For what I’ve heard japanese spend a lot of time working and their economy isn’t that great. People mostly avoid having children under these conditions for good reasons.
It’s not much better in the rest of the West too. Turns out that building a society where money and career determines your social status and doing unpaid work like taking care of a family and raising children is not valued at all and even very expensive makes people choose to have less or no children.
People of course do want children, but those that do very often will choose one or two children, below replacement rate.
I lived and worked in Japan before returning to the US. It’s much worse in Japan. When you leave college, you’re basically employed for life by one company. Your place in society is determined by your work in that company. My company was one of the more progressive ones. Salaried personnel still had to clock in and out to prevent people from working too much overtime. People put in great effort to cheat the time clock and put in more overtime than would be acceptable. People would get to work an hour early and leave at 10pm. There was little effort to make work more efficient because the employees can just work more. The company had an employee discount deal with customer products and employees were pressured into buying their products. It’s much better in America where the common tactic is to switch jobs every few years. America has a long way to go when it comes to work, but saying it’s almost as bad as Japan is just not true.
People of course do want children
Do they? I mean, even if first-world people aren’t as well-off as they could theoretically be, they’re still much better off than people in poor counties (or their own ancestors a hundred years ago). But those people in poor countries and those ancestors have/had a lot more children. Meanwhile people in Sweden have fewer children than people in the USA.
I think that many people in first-world countries do not in fact want children.
(And within a country, poor people have more children than rich people, so actually making more people poor would increase fertility.)
I am not sure if it’s really “I don’t want children” or more “I want a career (too)”. In Sweden 76 % of women are employed versus 57 % of women in USA. There are also more women with higher education in Sweden than in the USA.
You have to decide whether you want a career or a child. And when a good career is a viable and achievable option, you decide to have a career instead.
I wanted children, but I wanted to be independent and not poor when I am older, more. I know so many women who are poor and lonely because they did not focus on their jobs. While I am often sad to not have children, I’d never give up my independence and safety cushion just for that biological urge. I know of many women who think the same way.
Sure, and people in the south are popping them out like crazy even though they definitely can’t fucking afford them and need constant welfare support (that they’ll turn around and rail against politically) so it’s clear that things like education are also involved.
If people understood the scarcity of resources and their own earning potential they’d be fucking TERRIFIED of having children. Since they’re all dumbass hicks, they just fuck and don’t think about it. I’m sure Uncle Sam will show up with a other WIC check to help their poor decisions.
Not to mention most are psuedochristian so they won’t even think about an abortion (not that it’s legal in the south anymore…)
Turns out that building a society where money and career determines your social status and doing unpaid work like taking care of a family and raising children is not valued at all and even very expensive makes people choose to have less or no children.
In my country the state taxes the shit out of us while pays for the children of non-working people (there’s a shitload of subsidies going into their pockets), so that doesn’t help at all. What people need is money in their pockets, so having a children doesn’t bankrupt a family.
pays for the children of non-working people (there’s a shitload of subsidies going into their pockets),
Do children deserve to starve because their parents aren’t employed?
Do children deserve to starve because their parents aren’t employed?
Because they don’t want to work. There’s enough jobs.
And the children of these people deserve to starve?
Children should starve because their parents don’t want to be abused for $7 an hour, top post mate
Why the American flag. How do you know I’m speaking about US?
Get a grip.
Because the US is one of the best examples of your desire to see the children of poor and unemployed people starve?
“G-g-g-get a grip, I don’t like my shitty views being challenged and I can’t actually defend them”
Mate if you’re going to post dumb shit you probably should have a better response than that.
I’m assuming you’re not actually very dedicated to the idea of starving children, that’s just something you’ve heard and parroted because your own economic status is precarious
people deserve to starve in an age of plenty
this pigbrained subhuman cruelty betrays you as an american citizen, thank god your shithole is in decline lol you should all rot and die there for the good of the world
😠
Can you maybe not see entire groups as the same?
There are Americans that routinely get sent to jail protesting/fighting to change America for the better every day. There are those of us in this very thread that agree with you calling the other commentor a pigbrained subhuman. The strict adherence to an absolutely shit narrative given to them by Reich Wing Media disgusts a large portion of our population.
It’s not entirely our fault that propaganda is so effective at keeping the absolute worst possible people in office and rotting the brains of our neighbors. The blame rests on the oligarchs and ultra wealthy assholes looking to divide and conquer, turning all of us against each other while they laugh all the way to their 3rd private island…
I agree, some of you are alright, it is the elite of america and the very notion of “america” as a nation itself which must ultimately face justice for this situation. I hope you have a good day.
I only had to read this one comment to know that you’re a tankie who probably worships every little thing the Kremlin and the CCP say.
America falling apart would be horrifyingly destructive for the rest of the world, for it will allow other corrupt capitalist powers that are, let’s be honest, not as humane, take over the rest of the world.
Then again, the destabilization of the U.S. is well under way and our collapse is inevitable so I guess disputing it is a moot point.
America falling apart would be horrifyingly destructive for the rest of the world, for it will allow other corrupt capitalist powers that are, let’s be honest, not as humane, take over the rest of the world.
Well technically the continuation of america is more destructive than its inevitable decline, since america has a very awful pattern of killing millions of people for the enrichment of its elite, via means such as invasions, installing genocidal puppet leaders, and corporate extraction. The worst part is that america often destroys countries just as their people are on the brink of greater liberation.
Notable examples include:
Installing the Taliban in Afghanistan to oppose a Socialist government then destroying it
Destroying Iraq for Oil
Helping quash the Protocommunist Taiping Rebellion in China
The current blockade of Cuba
The current blockade of North Korea
The murder of socialist president Salvador Allende in Chile and the installation of Pinochet, a neoliberal dictator
The Contras
Sending $3 billion a year to isntreal for the mass killing of Palestinians
The genocide of first nations peoples on the North American continent itself
Assassinating Fred Hampton and the political killings of the Black Panther Party
Meddling in the affairs of practically every single third world country on Earth
Fucking Monsanto and their land grabbing bullshit
It is also probably the most inhumane of the corrupt capitalist powers as revealed in the details of these genocidal ventures either by using its own weapons or by proxy.
As such, the death of america would enable the possibility of a flourishing of socialist nations without the threat of the worlds most powerful military brought to full bear against their people for daring to pursue life, liberty, and happiness.
America falling apart would be horrifyingly destructive for the rest of the world, for it will allow other corrupt capitalist powers that are, let’s be honest, not as humane, take over the rest of the world.
This is what every imperial power says about itself
not as humane
It’s really hard to find someone worst? Look at what they did to Libya or are doing to Ukraine
other corrupt capitalist powers
Care to elaborate?
Damn it’s too bad we won’t have the humane government that did the Tuskegee Syphilis Experiment and invented Eugenics
Capitalism by its nature has an interest in keeping part of the working class unemployed. Look up “reserve army of labor”.
the children of non-working people
Your wording alone demonstrates exactly what SloppyEngineer said about unpaid work not being valued at all.
When you work 8 hours a day, have 1 hour lunch break, waste 2 hours commuting, to earn barely enough of what Adam Smith considers ideal (twice the cost of living), it’s hard to sustain a second person, much less a third that requires near constant monitoring for over 7 years.
From a pure economic perspective, a child is a total money sink for at least 18 years. In many places (mostly urban), it’s simply not viable to have one.
So how you propose to raise wages?
Short term, raise the minimum wage. Force walmart to fill the gaps between what they pay and what their workers need to live. Right now, it’s the government is subsidizing that gap.
Gigantic mothefucking emphasis on short term.
Our
piece of shit, bought and paid forpoliticians LOVE to pull the “we’re fighting to raise the minimum wage from X to Y!” but only over such a long timeline that the value of Y equals what X was… God forbid the Job Creators™©® have to ever actually pay more.Agreed, but getting an increase in minimum wage would get the ball rolling on other worker right reforms.
Why the hell is the government subsidising what a huge mega corp pays?
Because rich assholes need to feel speshul, so they waste money on lobbying to ensure those below them never get anywhere
Because the people who own the mega corps own the governments
Socialism for the rich, rugged individualism for the poor.
The rich can pay lobbyists to pay politicians.
The US government already subsidizes companies like Wal-Mart and Amazon because they force their lowest-paid employees to apply for food stamps even though they work.
Have you calculated how much money goes to these children of non-working people?
In my country, some get a minimum wage from just being at home, plus they get a subsidy for each kid they have.
While the working class gets only a small subsidy for each kid (the higher your income the less you get).
But how high is the rate of unemployment in your country? In Germany it is really low, so it probably costs a working person only a few euros per month to support all children of unemployed persons. Not sure if it is worth it to not help these children as they are already severely disadvantaged. Not to mention it can be seen as an investment in these children.
Now much, but people get basically a minimum wage from the state without any effort, so why work at all?
You would be surprised how many people actually cost the state money instead of bringing in money via tax in some countries. The problem isn’t the few unemployed people who could potentially work, the problem is that wages between high earners and low earners are out of proportion.
Incentivizing people to have children is pretty important for a society to continue on. Most societies are based around there being more young people than old people. When you reverse that, you historically don’t have enough people working to keep the country chugging along.
It’s crazy how much doesn’t even get done. No one wants to leave before their boss, so they space out their work and give the appearance of being busy.
And that’s unusual how?
Well for example, I leave before my boss all the time. Hell I work from home most days if I can.
If that’s normal, then this defense is a fatal indictment of normal
I’m a very strong advocate for a 20 hour work week…
For what I’ve heard japanese spend a lot of time working
According to the OECD, the average Japanese worker works just about the same number of hours per year as the average EU worker. It’s actually pretty surprising because the average Japanese worker seems to work less than workers in countries that most people do not think of as being overworked (e.g. Canada, Spain, Italy).
Of course, averages don’t account for distribution, so there absolutely are workers who are chronically overworked. There’s also more part-time workers in Japan, which kind of explains things. On the other hand, you then have to ask how/why it’s financially feasible for so many people to sustain their livelihoods with only part time work.
Begging my population to have kids instead of doing anything to address the conditions that make it impossible for enough of them to have kids
Oh yeah
Move over material analysis, It’s idealism as politics time
“Hey, baby, the prime minister is telling us to have kids. That’s got me pretty horny. No, he’s not making any significant changes to help take the edge off that massive expense and responsibility, but who cares? I’ll put his speech on loop and turn it up. Let’s fuck.”
“Also if it helps he’s been dead for over a year.”
Japan is trying to change things. I think it’s just really far behind. While I was there, I remember government run/funded dating programs. The government names and shames companies that overwork their employees. But their definition of overwork is probably well beyond ours. The one-employer-for-life mentality is slowly eroding but it’s slow.
Work hours are long and grueling. Childcare is phenomenally expensive, and that’s assuming you can even find childcare, which is near impossible. Children are expensive. Cost of living is high. Cheating and domestic violence are rates are high. Women have no confidence that they will be supported or be able to provide support if they decide to have a child, and they are very right to think that.
Scarce resources avaliable for women who have children is the reason for the decline. You could never pay me enough to ever have a child in Japan.
Not mention, plenty of Japanese adults grew up being abused and/or neglected by their own parents while growing up in a pressure-cooker society. Maybe they’re thinking twice about bringing another human into the world because of that, as well?
They also have this fucked up idea that pain is an important part of becoming a mother so they don’t really offer things like epidurals. Yeah, no thanks.
I am not personally familiar with the Japanese medical system, but I would not be shocked if that were the case.
Add “treating women really shitty and unfairly” to the checklist.
Japanese permanent resident here.
Epidurals are very rare. They exist but they are not popular at all. Some is the belief that a “natural” birth is better. In some cases it is just availability of an anesthiaologist that is equipped to do one. Some people just don’t even realise it is an option. The only people I know here who have had one were non-Japanese residents.
I don’t think people necessarily look down on a mother who has one, it’s rare enough that nobody would even ask probably, but it’s just not a common procedure.
Human reproduction is an astoundingly bad deal reserved for the richest and most powerful who can outsources the endless source of problems briefs and complications that it is.
The only reason this continued for so long is that we were too stupid to realize not doing it was an option.
Idk man I really love my kid.
assuming you can even find childcare
I think this needs an ‘affordable’ thrown in. The free and cheap stuff is really hard to get into, but there are other, more expensive options (though out of reach of most).
plenty of Japanese adults grew up being abused and/or neglected by their own parents
Do what now? Source?
These links are not for the faint of heart.
https://metropolisjapan.com/the-controversy-of-japans-baby-hatch/
And this is only what gets reported. Rest assured, a majority of abuse is never reported.
Poverty is so much more prevalent for single mothers, as well.
Yeah, it was definitely up during corona. All domestic abuse was up then (and in a lot of the world).
For your first link, it states that the abuse found is more extreme, but the source they link to doesn’t work. I do remember the horrible story of that poor child from the news here. It then goes on to just give numbers with no citations or sources whatsoever. The whole publication also seems a bit weird.
Abandonment of infants is definitely a thing that happens and I’m glad that a baby hatch solution now exists.
I do agree that often abuse goes unreported and/or un-prosecuted (as do rapes and many other crimes in Japan). I just don’t see anything here stating that it’s on the scale I seemed to think you were saying.
Things for single mothers does need to get a lot better; making women more equal in society and actually enforcing the protections on their jobs and family leave could go a long way to this.
I’ve been living in Japan the better part of a decade. I’ve had friends from all walks of life. Some did open up to me about abuse (I was also an abused child for a good chunk of my childhood and have sometimes talked about it), but I’ve really heard no more here than in the US. There are two problems with this. (1) it’s anecdotal based on the experience of one guy in Tokyo and (2) what some people would call abuse, others would not making things even more sticky.
I do think that, whatever the scale of abuse, non-zero is too much and that should be addressed, but I also don’t think it’s some super-regular thing which is what I think you were intending to write,
Missing picture of Abe holding his stomach: “You had time to make a mother fucking blunderbuss, but not enough to fuck?!”
“You are the one who is fucked now, Abe-kun.”
Yamagami has enough fans now he definitely could, they just need to let him out.
“The only thing I’m interested in ‘fucking’ is the cult that runs at the underpinnings of this government”
-Yamagami probably.
His story is amazing. Radicalized by the equivalent of Japan’s alt right, then when he realized that’s who exactly grifted his mother to give away the family wealth, turned his attention to that.
Racialized or radicalized?
So, he fell for the alt-right bullshit, then later realized they were the grifters and scammers, not the filthy gaijin? That culminating in the assassination of Shinzo Abe sounds straight out of a revenge movie
I can’t find the article that mentioned his shift in political views, but he was a hardcore alt-right type before realizing that’s who swindled his mother.
Here’s an article in the Japanese Times. More or less, different publications all have the same story.
One thing that does change depending on when the article was written is Abe’s connection with the church and the church’s connections to the Japanese and South Korean governments. Police withheld certain details until after the elections and approval ratings for the party dropped after. Generally, people aren’t too happy with that and there was even push back about the government paying for Abe’s funeral.
How would they have time? They all work 15 hours per day
Okay what? Isn’t the average workweek length in Japan only slightly longer than in the West?
The official work hours, sure. All the unpaid, unreported overtime they have to do, nope.
Technically the work week is the same, not factoring in commutes. Folks who work in Tokyo often live in neighboring cities like Saitama and commute in.
There’s typically a lot of unpaid overtime though. There is the concept of “black companies” that force employees to work up to 100 hours a week. To some degree the government has been trying to crack down on it, and has met with some success, especially with the bigger international. My company is the Japanese branch of a US company, so we are a little better than most, but some of that still happens. I probably work about 45-50 hours a week on the clock on average, plus maybe 2-3 off the clock. I don’t live or work in Tokyo anymore, so my commute is fairly insignificant.
Thankfully the “you have to go out drinking with all of your coworkers after work” thing has mostly fallen by the wayside. Those events still happen, but it is way more acceptable to just…not go.
Source: I have worked in Japan my entire adult life
From the moment I understood the weakness of my flesh, it disgusted me. I craved the strength and certainty of steel. I aspired to the purity of the Blessed Machine.
unplugs amazon dot
This “weakness” is the only thing that makes existence remotely tolerable.
Your kind cling to your flesh, as though it will not decay and fail you.
not so fast, Abe-sama. I have the power of Hexbear emojis nowThe fact you guys have The Blaster as an emoji is just
It’s a DOOHICKEY. Blasters are for starwars libs.
I stand corrected comrade. I admit I lack the technical expertise on doohickeys, I need to study more.
One day you too will know such arcane things, and everyone will like you very much.
What are the R’s and the I’s under the picture?
R’s : Replies to that post
I’s : No# images attached to replies of that post
Many thanks.
Abe was a fascist shit, he deserved it.
Gotta do the rest of the liberal party too unfortunately though.
Shinzo Abe was a clown and Japan’s abortion laws are draconian.
Oral contraceptives were legalized in 1999.
have sex
Bear children to feed into the soulless machine of neoliberal international capital ? No thanks Abe, I choose extinction. Humanity would have been gone long ago, we just didn’t realise we had the choice to not continue existing. Thank you inventor of abortion and contraceptive pill finally we can escape this horrible planet and cease to exist.
Haha there are so many emotions in that expression
Oh wow anti-natalists are back haha this is wild
Nihilism is actively encouraged by the ruling class
You ok bro?
youre so wise, you could start with yourself
That’s just dumb. Killing yourself only removes one problem, you gotta pump up your KDA first.
“neo liberal”
There’s nothing “liberal” about forcing people to breed to protect corporations and their profits. That’s not what that word means.
Yes it does outside of USA
Given the context Interdimemsionalmeme provides in their comment, I think neoliberal makes perfect sense. Why bring another human being into a dying world where their labor will be exploited until they die?
Because in all of human history, the people who exploit workers are NOT liberal. They are the robber barons who run governments and corporations. Words mean things. So either you don’t know what “liberal” means or you are UP to something, trying to push some "everything bad in the world the fault of ‘liberals’ " nosense.
If u disagree with the term neoliberalism that’s fine but it’s a widespread and useful term that exists in common usage regardless as to what u think of it. If u haven’t read its definition I recommend u check it out! ☺️
To be fair “neoliberalim” is a really misleading name. It does basically just mean “proto-conservative” which can be really confusing if you don’t already know what you’re talking about
I guess it’s misleading if you don’t know history?
Words mean things.
Yes and neoliberalism means something that you apparently are too lazy to click a link to learn.
You should educate yourself instead of continuing to argue against using a word you can’t define.
I think it’s best that you take some sort of political history course before you start yelling at other people about how ‘they’re using liberal wrong’. Just because something has the word liberal in it does not mean it is in reference to certain democratic socialist ideologies; or god forbid you think that liberalism and leftism are synonymous.
Liberalism is the ideology of capitalism.
lmao. the politics understander has logged on.
@NutWrench @interdimensionalmeme, neo-liberal sounds better than f…ng nazis.
Nah, don’t think I’m going to be taking advice from a holocaust-denying nationalist piece of shit about anything. May he rest in piss.
I completely forgot this guy got blunderbussed straight to hell until now.
- critical support to this thing
claims to be pro natalist
-1
