There’s been a few discussions about this, you are probably downvoting AI posts and if it’s a pattern (just downvotes without anything else) they see it as non-constructive participation and ban you.
Not saying I completely agree, but I get where they are coming from. Communities should be free from drive-by downvotes, no matter the subject. Even stuff I hate should get a community, it’s up to me to ignore it
i never understood why folks get so anal about downvoting. if I don’t like it, I downvote. it’s my vote. if it’s a “rule” to only downvote people who don’t participate “properly” instead of people you disagree with… I’m downvoting the rule.
if a community can’t handle the “risk” inherent with people disagreeing with them on the internet then they should realize they are not ready for the internet.
shit… I reply about some stuff and let folks know I’m a leftist and … instant downvotes. hrm. 😂🤷♂️
Downvoting has consequences on visibility for the discussion to others. You simply downvoting for something you disagree with means you only want things you agree with visible to read. I believe downvoting should be reserved for posts that actively subtract from the discussion.
However, following the rule of “treat others how you want to be treated”, I have downvoted your post because I disagree with it, and you are communicating thats how you’d like it.
If I’m browsing All and I see something that is promoting a stance that I feel is damaging to society, I downvote it. Damn right! I don’t want the idea spreading.
If I’m browsing All and I see something that is promoting a stance that I feel is damaging to society, I downvote it. Damn right! I don’t want the idea spreading.
I actually had text in my post I deleted because I thought it obvious addressing this. Homophobic, racist, misogynistic, etc post always gets a downvote from me too.
i believe downvoting should be something users can use for whatever reasons they deem necessary. after all, it’s there for that reason. if a community wanted me to “explain” why I downvoted, I can safely assume it’ll either unlock that downvote button when I have replied to the thread, or prompt me before allowing the button to be confirmed.
Thats a disappointing take. In public on a street, you’re not prevented from walking up to someone and telling them you think they are ugly and stupid if you feel like it. Your logic is that there should be a law preventing it, and if not, then its absolutely fine to do that thing. I would hope you wouldn’t because you understand your actions have consequences on other people and society even if you technically are allowed to do something.
Its the same thing with the “vote” buttons. You have the power to do something, but you are saying you just don’t care what the consequences to others are from your actions.
If you ever wonder why the internet is worse, its looks like its because you’re giving yourself a free pass to be mean. I suppose you can enjoy the world you create for yourself.
Voting is not supposed to be like/dislike btw. Voting is supposed to indicate the relevance to the topic. In theory this is how the correct content should come to the top and the irrelevant content drops out.
But no one knows that and just votes with emotions instead.
Voting is whatever the person voting wants it to be. Just because people want it to be one thing doesn’t make it that thing. Some people will vote capriciously, some will vote with great logic. Some will vote emotionally, others will only vote for relevant topics. Vote how you like and stop worrying about a few pixels on a screen. Karma is worth nothing on this site so don’t worry about it unless you want mental health problems.
IIUC, votes are just what Mastodon (or I suppose, more like Pleroma) uses for reactions. I bet there’s no reason we can’t sidevote each other, with a little API shenanigans! Personally, I would like a vote for “I’m not gonna tell you”.
if the conversation is supposed to be dialectical then “votes” should not be a thing; this is what comments are for.
“votes” are just a way to make one think it’s democracy in a community with some dopamine feedback when you see your post got 3500 upvotes because you posted a meme.
i never understood why folks get so anal about downvoting. if I don’t like it, I downvote. it’s my vote.
Because it’s a net negative on a community. (gen)AI is already controversial, so if a community wants to grow and get visibility, the last they can use is a bunch of bitter users that downvote every new post and don’t interact with the community in any other, meaningful way.
neat. so that must mean they are not ready for the audience.
I grew up with bbs, usenet, forums, fark, yadda yadda. downvotes are there for a reason - and if the community can’t handle it then either turn them off (that’s ok too!) or … ignore them. it’s not like “karma” is a thing here either.
Per flandish, we can all downvote anything we want for whatever reason we want. But we must be aware that our votes are visible, social actions, and we must accept the consequences that come from those actions, which might quite reasonably involve being excluded from further socializing.
i’m banned from a lot of these communities i’ve discovered. i don’t do downvotes of relevant posts in their own communities, i just block such communities, so it will also be based on comment content it seems.
decent chance lol. but i didn’t ask for this either. it’s like there’s an internet civil war and i got a side assigned to me. i’m not switching sides, i got sorted right, but it’s weird to me, an internet old head
Yeah I like this, it makes karma farming less plausible too. Although imo they should remove all public visibility of votes and just leave the algo to work behind the scenes
That’s not what is usually meant by that. We had sorting and ranking for literally centuries before what is currently referred to as “the algorithm” on proprietary platforms. But I now understand what was meant, and that it wasn’t important to your point.
But I have never downvoted AI posts in the community, and I just found out about the community today. My guess is because of my stance on Anti Big Tech AI
Like seeing the content in your all/new feed, and just downvoting the stuff you don’t like while scrolling past them. Instead of engaging with the community (with comments or nuanced posts) or ignoring them, it’s actively harming communities. Right now it’s easy to hate on AI, but it works for any community.
Again, easy to say because it’s AI. If you apply this logic to other, less-controversial communities that are honestly trying to make it out there, would you still have the same stance?
Also, don’t take this as me defending AI or whatever. I block all communities immediately.
yes, some stuff is just bad. I usually downvote and then block the community if it shows up
but I have been on the lemmy now for long enough to have a good collection of communities and rarely use the all set. So I don’t find I have to do this as much anymore.
I actually enjoy going to new and helping things with an up vote even if I don’t really care what it is but it looks like it should get more attention
There’s been a few discussions about this, you are probably downvoting AI posts and if it’s a pattern (just downvotes without anything else) they see it as non-constructive participation and ban you.
Not saying I completely agree, but I get where they are coming from. Communities should be free from drive-by downvotes, no matter the subject. Even stuff I hate should get a community, it’s up to me to ignore it
i never understood why folks get so anal about downvoting. if I don’t like it, I downvote. it’s my vote. if it’s a “rule” to only downvote people who don’t participate “properly” instead of people you disagree with… I’m downvoting the rule.
if a community can’t handle the “risk” inherent with people disagreeing with them on the internet then they should realize they are not ready for the internet.
shit… I reply about some stuff and let folks know I’m a leftist and … instant downvotes. hrm. 😂🤷♂️
Downvoting has consequences on visibility for the discussion to others. You simply downvoting for something you disagree with means you only want things you agree with visible to read. I believe downvoting should be reserved for posts that actively subtract from the discussion.
However, following the rule of “treat others how you want to be treated”, I have downvoted your post because I disagree with it, and you are communicating thats how you’d like it.
If I’m browsing All and I see something that is promoting a stance that I feel is damaging to society, I downvote it. Damn right! I don’t want the idea spreading.
I actually had text in my post I deleted because I thought it obvious addressing this. Homophobic, racist, misogynistic, etc post always gets a downvote from me too.
that’s ok with me. :)
i believe downvoting should be something users can use for whatever reasons they deem necessary. after all, it’s there for that reason. if a community wanted me to “explain” why I downvoted, I can safely assume it’ll either unlock that downvote button when I have replied to the thread, or prompt me before allowing the button to be confirmed.
Thats a disappointing take. In public on a street, you’re not prevented from walking up to someone and telling them you think they are ugly and stupid if you feel like it. Your logic is that there should be a law preventing it, and if not, then its absolutely fine to do that thing. I would hope you wouldn’t because you understand your actions have consequences on other people and society even if you technically are allowed to do something.
Its the same thing with the “vote” buttons. You have the power to do something, but you are saying you just don’t care what the consequences to others are from your actions.
a) internet forums are public but they are not “in public”
b) reductio ad absurdum is peak internet. good work.
If you ever wonder why the internet is worse, its looks like its because you’re giving yourself a free pass to be mean. I suppose you can enjoy the world you create for yourself.
what is “mean” about downvoting something I disagree with?
Voting is not supposed to be like/dislike btw. Voting is supposed to indicate the relevance to the topic. In theory this is how the correct content should come to the top and the irrelevant content drops out.
But no one knows that and just votes with emotions instead.
🤷♂️
Voting is whatever the person voting wants it to be. Just because people want it to be one thing doesn’t make it that thing. Some people will vote capriciously, some will vote with great logic. Some will vote emotionally, others will only vote for relevant topics. Vote how you like and stop worrying about a few pixels on a screen. Karma is worth nothing on this site so don’t worry about it unless you want mental health problems.
That’s what’s neat about the internet.
The rules are made up and the points don’t matter.
IIUC, votes are just what Mastodon (or I suppose, more like Pleroma) uses for reactions. I bet there’s no reason we can’t sidevote each other, with a little API shenanigans! Personally, I would like a vote for “I’m not gonna tell you”.
citation required
it’s a priori.
Principal skinner “No, it’s the children who are wrong” meme energy here.
If the vast majority of people are using the system “wrong”, it’s probably not those people’s fault.
if the conversation is supposed to be dialectical then “votes” should not be a thing; this is what comments are for.
“votes” are just a way to make one think it’s democracy in a community with some dopamine feedback when you see your post got 3500 upvotes because you posted a meme.
Because it’s a net negative on a community. (gen)AI is already controversial, so if a community wants to grow and get visibility, the last they can use is a bunch of bitter users that downvote every new post and don’t interact with the community in any other, meaningful way.
Zooming out, the AI stuff is a negative for the wider community. Maybe it shouldn’t grow and become visible
Sure, but the community owners can still ban you for trying to actively reduce their visibility.
I’m not saying I’d like that to happen, but it works both ways.
neat. so that must mean they are not ready for the audience.
I grew up with bbs, usenet, forums, fark, yadda yadda. downvotes are there for a reason - and if the community can’t handle it then either turn them off (that’s ok too!) or … ignore them. it’s not like “karma” is a thing here either.
You’re choosing to crush all nuance. Like you are invested in a specific conclusion.
i don’t understand - is there a per-community threshold where a certain low score means it’s not displayed to other users?
What is a thing is visibility. It’s not about karma.
It’s up to you to ignore them, not the other way around. And their community, their rules: they can ban you for whatever they want.
It works both ways. If you can’t handle being banned unfairly, then you’re not ready for the internet.
Per flandish, we can all downvote anything we want for whatever reason we want. But we must be aware that our votes are visible, social actions, and we must accept the consequences that come from those actions, which might quite reasonably involve being excluded from further socializing.
are downvotes visible on a user’s profile? or just in log/mod log details?
It’s meant for mods/admins only, but there are sites that publicize it for the obsessives that need to know exactly who dared to give them a downvote.
cool! i like more and more how open federated stuff is.
100% agree.
the internet is full of users free to use the options given to them in ways they see fit.
i’m banned from a lot of these communities i’ve discovered. i don’t do downvotes of relevant posts in their own communities, i just block such communities, so it will also be based on comment content it seems.
If they live by what they preach they’ll be modding via AI.
i’ve considered this as what’s going on
What about based on being a mod of certain communities? ;)
decent chance lol. but i didn’t ask for this either. it’s like there’s an internet civil war and i got a side assigned to me. i’m not switching sides, i got sorted right, but it’s weird to me, an internet old head
The instance I’m on completely ignores downvotes. They just aren’t a thing. An upvote is an upvote. A downvote is… nothing. It’s a nice compromise. :)
Yeah I like this, it makes karma farming less plausible too. Although imo they should remove all public visibility of votes and just leave the algo to work behind the scenes
There is no algo. Voting is a social action. Fuck the hypothetical algo.
As a lemmy veteran, you should know better: https://join-lemmy.org/docs/users/03-votes-and-ranking.html
Call it what you want, it’s math to sort posts and comments.
Edit: even better link: https://join-lemmy.org/docs/contributors/07-ranking-algo.html
That’s not what is usually meant by that. We had sorting and ranking for literally centuries before what is currently referred to as “the algorithm” on proprietary platforms. But I now understand what was meant, and that it wasn’t important to your point.
hot, active, new, top, and controversial are all algorithms
Yes, assuming that they actually do anything at all, one could call them algorithms. But they are not what is colloquially called “the algorithm.”
But I have never downvoted AI posts in the community, and I just found out about the community today. My guess is because of my stance on Anti Big Tech AI
It can be, an admin could double check I guess but I don’t think it’s worth finding out.
I blocked them early btw, so I don’t even see them :P
What is “drive by downvotes” exactly?
Like seeing the content in your all/new feed, and just downvoting the stuff you don’t like while scrolling past them. Instead of engaging with the community (with comments or nuanced posts) or ignoring them, it’s actively harming communities. Right now it’s easy to hate on AI, but it works for any community.
shitty content should get shitty reviews (downvotes)
Again, easy to say because it’s AI. If you apply this logic to other, less-controversial communities that are honestly trying to make it out there, would you still have the same stance?
Also, don’t take this as me defending AI or whatever. I block all communities immediately.
yes, some stuff is just bad. I usually downvote and then block the community if it shows up
but I have been on the lemmy now for long enough to have a good collection of communities and rarely use the all set. So I don’t find I have to do this as much anymore.
I actually enjoy going to new and helping things with an up vote even if I don’t really care what it is but it looks like it should get more attention
I mean, that’s fair.
Downvoting the stuff you don’t like is how forums with voting work and I would argue it is engaging with the community. How isn’t it?
I might be explaining it badly. It’s more like targeting. Maybe this thread helps? https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/49180918
It kinda sounds like you are almost referring to brigading?
Nah, brigading is more active than just voting.
But it’s ok if I’m “drive-by” upvoting? I basically upvote everything from 196. How is this any different?