You must log in or register to comment.
Rich men would invest in their own bones, the rest of us would die even earlier than a women do.
Aging should be studied a lot more. I believe once the AI bubble pops, the computing power and models should be applied to biology. How do ageless atoms become old meat? I want to know, as an old meat myself, and if we can treat, stop, or even reverse the process.
How do ageless atoms become old meat? I want to know, as an old meat myself, and if we can treat, stop, or even reverse the process.
Atoms must arrange themselves in a particular way to become a cell. A cell knows how to make copies of itself, but sometimes mistakes can happen. Like a game of telephone, the cell at the end of the line only knows how to make a copy of itself, not how to make a copy of the original cell it came from. The mistakes gradually accumulate over time, which causes improperly formed cells to accumulate over time and give the appearance of “aging”.
In theory, aging is a condition that is surmountable. There are jellyfish that are swimming in the ocean right now that are functionally immortal. They create perfect copies of their DNA every single time, and can repair damage to cells without leaving a trace of the original injury. If we could figure out the processes that allow them to do this, it could be applied to the human genome as well.
And yet everyone seems to age the same. Funny how those “mistakes” never turn me into a whale or a plant, I surmise it’s a bit more complex than that.
I think that’s accounted for under mutations and cancer and such. You theoretically could mutate into a whale but the probability of your cells making specific enough mistakes for that to happen is so astronomically small that it’s essentially zero.
That’s…not how it works. If I kept copying a car, using the previous one as a stencil, I’d eventually end up with something that mostly resembles a car but ultimately doesn’t work properly. Eventually, it would fail to function at all but at a glance it would look more or less the same. At no point would it ever resemble a motorcycle and by the time such a mistake would happen I would have stopped even trying long before that or, to go back to cells, the body would have died because too many things weren’t working correctly to live long enough to turn into a different animal entirely.
AI is going to be applied to biology.
They’ll develop all sorts of bioweapons. They’ve all ready made huge strides in parasymoethetic nerve agents.
On the other hand, men on average live shorter, and we just go “well it’s just risky behavior and physical labor I guess 🤷♂️” and they’re aren’t any task forces for that either, truth is we as a society don’t care enough about these issues regardless of sex
This is kind of incorrect. The leading cause of death (in the US) is heart disease, followed by cancer:
https://www.voronoiapp.com/healthcare/What-are-the-leading-causes-of-death-for-men-and-women-4775
Obviously those affect both men and women, but men are represented higher in both causes. Heart disease and cancer absolutely have large research groups focused on them, they aren’t being ignored by society at large.
Cancer is a really broad cause of death. The cancer that has arguably the best funded research is breast cancer, which mostly affects women.
I’m on the fence with your comment. Society viewing men as disposable is definitely a thing, and we do end up doing more hazardous and physically demanding work on the whole. The risks are real. Some of our mortality is hardwired, with men more prone to taking risks, which also drags the average.
You are also right about society not caring, though I would argue it’s the system we subscribe to.
I’m hesitant to fully jump on board with your comment because it’s close to bringing the whole ‘men too’ crowd which often has a note of toxicity to it.
The argument shouldnt be men vs. women, but people vs. those who exploit us, or people vs. the problem
The argument shouldnt be men vs. women, but people vs. those who exploit us, or people vs. the problem
But aren’t you doing the first, rather than the second with your post?
The argument shouldnt be men vs. women, but people vs. those who exploit us, or people vs. the problem
This is what I tried to hint at.
No it’s exactly what you said. Not sure why OP is on the fence.
You are also right about society not caring, though I would argue it’s the system we subscribe to.
How is this different in the context of healthcare for women?
I’m hesitant to fully jump on board with your comment because it’s close to bringing the whole ‘men too’ crowd which often has a note of toxicity to it.
This is irrelevant. The point is either valid or it isn’t. Neither you nor the person you’re talking to are responsible for the reactions of third parties. Judge the point being made on its own merits.
The argument shouldnt be men vs. women, but people vs. those who exploit us, or people vs. the problem
In an ideal world, maybe. But the health issues in question are relevant to a person’s sexual development (male vs. female) therefore it is functionally impossible to remove sex from the discussion.
It’s not really different in the contex of womens’ experiences in healthcare. What I’m alluding to here is that we all buy into this system (regardless of if we want to or not) rather than challenge it.
Irrelevant
Then their point is valid, I’m just disinclined to champion it because of shitty third party actors. I will acknowledge it’s validity though.
Ideal world
I’m not trying to remove sex from this particular issue but highlight that this issue is a smaller part of a systemic problem
This is irrelevant. The point is either valid or it isn’t.
The world isn’t a logic table.
A lot of it is self-inflicted. Largely do to machismo culture, men tend to avoid the doctor. Women are less likely to be pig-headed about going to the doc.
“Self-inflicted” but when women suffer from e.g. ridiculous beauty standards, then it is a societal issue.
Machismo culture is not “self-inflicted” because
- Men are not a “self”. Even if my father would have raised me like that, I am not my father, so consequently it wouldn’t be self-inflicted.
- Society is promoting and pushing machismo culture to men. Men are not the only one promoting it. Women promote machismo culture too. I can tell you that from my own personal experience and frankly, personally, I felt greater pressure from women in my life than from men to be “toxic-masucline”.
And obviously, it is wrong that women suffer from societal pressure too and they have my full support. This is not about demonising women, it is about calling out the narrative that societal pressure on men is “self-inflicted” and societal pressure on women is “caused by men”. We all do it and we all need to stop. Support each other. Raise your children to be supportive of self expression. Sexism is bad.
You are a cigarette op
This is such gender war dog shit.
The elite and society at large doesn’t care about anyone in the lower classes, man or women, young or old.
Pointing out gender-related issues is not a “gender war”. Discussing someone else’s issues is not an attack on you.
Putting the gender-related issues into a meme with a “if this affected men then there would be more funding” doesn’t feel like discussing issues and more like “gender war”.
Ok to your second sentence, but it is proven over and over again that health care for women is at a much lower standard than for men. Less funding, less research, less care. Those are objective facts. Calling that out is not creating a gender war its identifying a drastic gap that has been written about in countless medical journals for decades.
are we really calling awareness of gender issues gender war? how do you expect gender issues to be resolved if no one’s allowed to talk about them?
turns out there’s some pretty major issues with the gender binary, but I’m not sure how you expect to fix that without talking about it. it’s fair to say capatilism is part of the root cause but reducing it to solely that is a little disingenuous.
Mindlessly criticising something and making it about your own pet “war”
The wealthy and powerful see the bodies of the working class the same way they see the natural resources of the planet. When all your value has been extracted, your husk will be cast aside or used as a means to extract wealth or value from someone else.
Leftists who view everything as a class issue get their asses handed to them at the polls every time. Yes, you can come up with some complicated strained logic for why things like homophobia or racism are a class issue, but that just doesn’t jive with what people experience in their actual lives. And you can stamp your feet and say that class issues are the most important issue, and everything else is secondary. Meanwhile, targeted minority groups will ignore you and focus on their actual real most important issues.
I mean, let’s be honest, it would have to be rich white men losing 20%, then we would find a cure, and price it so that anyone else couldn’t afford it, even if it cost like $12 to make
They do. Men lose bone density as well, just at a slower rate. It’s at about 20% when men are 60 instead of 50.
They won’t cure something that they can profit from by making something a subscription.
~Baldness. Erectile Dysfunction. Incontinence.~
Same principal that IT works off of now. Hey, get rid of the email client you’ve been comfortably using for years, and instead buy this jankier version that you need to pay a subscription for…
The anti vaxx movement was a conspiracy by big pharma to get people to stop taking the cheapest way to prevent disease, so that they can profit on the expensive ways to treat those easily preventable diseases.
Ah. The insulin racket
* US insulin racket. Be specific.
It’s actually even worse than it sounds.
This is a solved problem. Resistance training is incredibly effective at not just preventing but totally reversing bone loss in women. That is on top of about a hundred thousand other proven benefits of training. Literally 30 minutes a week at planet fitness with a halfway decent plan can gift you 30+ quality adjusted life years.
But how do we treat this proven, accessible, miraculous cure to this life threatening problem that every woman faces? Well, we endure extreme societal pressure to avoid lifting weights at all costs of course! Wouldn’t want to accidentally become too manly!
Literally everyone should be sickened by this state of affairs
This is a solved problem.
That’s a really goddamn bold claim that you don’t bother to back up. Here’s a 2025 systematic review and meta-analysis exploring our current understanding of how resistance training improves bone mineral density in postmenopausal women.
Here’s their conclusion:
Resistance training can beneficially influence BMD [bone mineral density] in postmenopausal women, particularly at the LS [lumbar spine], FN [femoral neck], and TH [total hip]. A high-intensity training regimen (≥ 70% 1RM [1-rep max]) performed three times per week with a longer training duration may be optimal. However, significant heterogeneity among the included studies for LS and FN bone density may affect the accuracy of the pooled results, thereby limiting the generalizability of these findings. More high-quality clinical trials are needed to confirm these findings.
So it’s good. Nobody would deny that it’s good. The problem is when you start throwing around terms like “solved” and “miraculous cure” to complex medical problems without anything to back it up – especially in an era of rampant medical disinformation.
I think the previous comment was rather hyperbolic, but to a degree it’s true. I wouldn’t call it solved, obviously, since removing all other factors, women experience more osteoporosis and overall bone loss than men in general. Though when we consider activity, it’s more common for men to be physically active in general, and higher overall muscle mass means greater bone density in the longer term, to my understanding.
But also, most of western society is extremely sedentary, and there is a certain inertia when it comes to encouraging physical fitness as a solution. People do tend to want a magic pill for things. Just look at all the fervor over Ozempic.
Thank you for actually engaging with the post instead of devolving into a holier-than-thou wanna-be-lawyer analysis that is selectively deaf to existence of hyperbole!
I would say that we can’t ignore the historical or biological context of why women experience more osteoporosis. Menopause obviously, but also the pressure to avoid training.
Given the biological context, and the proven effectiveness of training, the only honest conclusion is that training is more important for women than men. Yet it’s still far more common for women to be pushed away from the gym, due to it widely being considered masculine. Hopefully we can all work together to rectify this serious issue
I wonder how it looks for women who started before menopause though rather than after.
Incredibly disingenuous of you to phrase it as “unable to deny that it’s good” while posting irrelevant snippets from studies. Yes, research is still ongoing on how much resistance training is needed to reap the full benefits. Research of this type will always be ongoing.
Meanwhile, the consensus of all medical experts is that women should be training because it has the power to reverse the course of this debilitating illness, among about a hundred thousand other significant benefits. We’re not at the “looking into it” stage, we’re at “the mayo clinic officially recommends training” stage.
Everyone with an idea of how debilitating illnesses usually play out will have correctly identified this as a being a miracle. You, like me, should be rejoicing in this fact and going out into the streets to yell this news at everyone who will listen.
It is such a sadness that women have for so long been robbed of their opportunity to partake in training due to stigma
Instead of just critiquing, how about you actually try to back up your claim that resistance training significantly improves bone density or prevents bone loss in women? As you haven’t provided any sources, it sounds like you’re just repeating gym bro anecdotal knowledge. You’re the one making that claim.
There’s plenty of studies on the effects of resistance training on Osteosarcopenia and Osteoporosis. You’re being a little ridiculous here. It’s a simple google search away.
- https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6279907/
- https://www.health.harvard.edu/staying-healthy/strength-training-builds-more-than-muscles
- https://www.orthopt.org/blog/the-role-of-strength-training-in-preventing-osteoporosis-functional-exercises-and-evidence-based-benefits
- https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25772806/
- https://theros.org.uk/information-and-support/bone-health/exercise-for-bones/
- https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9927006/
You want a source for the consensus of all credible medical experts? Sure, you can start with the link the other user posted which 100% confirms the claim and also has its own enormous list of sources.
You could then type “resistance training osteoporosis mayo clinic” into your favorite search bar to see why they so strongly advise resistance training for women with the condition.
You could then try doing the same with literally any and every institution.
There’s a reason it devolved into “unable to say that it’s not good”. It is simply an established fact that training increases your bone density. This is obviously a godsend for those of us predisposed to reduced bone density as we age.
And for the record, I 100% stand with whatever gym bros you are referring to who are begging older ladies to come train with them so they can maintain their quality of life and independence as they age. Did you intend that as an insult? You make them sound like the chillest, nicest people on earth lol
Removed by mod
Removed by mod
I’ve never heard of a guy not wanting their girl to do strength training, that just makes the girl hotter…
Maybe that’s like an old person thing? Like gen x and older?
Not sure it’s a generation thing. For example, Gen X grew up with ladies workout videos, thigh master, the little white guy with the Afro, etc. Could this be a reaction to the body positivity movement?
Maybe it’s not a “this is what men desire” thing but rather a “this is what society as a whole expects of women” thing
Well, we endure extreme societal pressure to avoid lifting weights
Is this actually true? Like half the women I know lift and gymfluencers is a huge thing
It sounds like you’ve cultivated a very gym positive space, and that’s great! But yes it far more common still for women to be repulsed by the idea of lifting weights, often because of fears of “becoming too big” or “looking like a man”
Acceptance of lifting is absolutely growing among women, as it should be, but there’s a lot of work left to do!
I gotta say though, there are a ton of women lifting at the gyms I’ve gone to
Same with mine! There’s been a lot of outreach and acceptance and many women have discovered that training can be a joy. I think much credit can also be granted to the sport of women’s powerlifting, which is growing rapidly
Will be even more fun when the ozempic / wegovy / semaglutude users start falling apart.
Do we have any actual evidence of this, or is this just Faustian speculation?
Whenever there is as new, truly revolutionary medical treatment, there is always a mountain of fear mongering around it. People just don’t want to accept that we actually can make real progress. Hell, any time there is any new treatment discusses, the top posts are always people saying that only the rich will ever be able to afford it. Of course, every treatment starts that way, and countless treatments that were once only for the rich can now be enjoyed by everyone.
I think it’s a logical error that people make, simply because they are wary of scams. It’s generally healthy to be skeptical of miraculous promises. But that goes too far when people replace “we should treat this skeptically” with “there simply must be some horrible cost to this revolutionary good thing. I will assume there is one, even if there is no evidence for it. Anything that good has to be a deal with the Devil carrying some horrible cost.”
It’s a serious concern. To properly lose weight with the support of these drugs you need resistance training and to eat right
Funny enough, Cory Doctorow covered something similar in his book Makers. There was a therapy (I forget, either injection or gene therapy) that led to obese people being able to eat whatever they want and still get thin. They ended up essentially skeletal and brittle in the end over years, turned out it’s very bad for you and they ended up needed to eat like 10k calories a day to survive.
deleted by creator
Post needs accessibility.
Isn’t this a case for hormone replacement therapy? I thought physicians recommend it nowadays.
alt-text
A tweet from Davey Maher Fitness (@David_Maher) reads:
“If men lost 20% of their skeleton by 50, there’d be billion-dollar task forces overnight.
But when women’s bones crumble after menopause?
It’s just called ‘aging.’ No scans. No BHRT. No urgency.
Just Mickey Mouse bloodwork & ‘take your calcium, honey’ — & pray you don’t snap a hip.
This is medical neglect.
Demand better.”
———
A comment below by @drmaryclaire says:
“This post about osteoporosis and bone loss — and the differences between females and males — triggered me in my tracks.
Agree or disagree with the methodology, what struck me most was this:
A non-physician male recognizing and calling out the massive discrepancy in how we talk about, study, and treat bone loss in women.
This is the kind of awareness and conversation we need more of.
Because women deserve better.”
While that’s a nice effort, the post remains inaccessible, and the only remedy is for OP to fix their post (easiest remedy: link to source). To explain, opening every inaccessible post to maybe find a detached, buried comment of unclear reliability demands inequitably more of the disabled user than everyone else, so it isn’t a remedy.
Maybe that’s why women are not predominantly used as cannon fodder in the frontlines of war?
???
The post is BS, society sees both women and men as disposable as long as they are lower class. Osteoporosis also hits men although at a lower incidence. At best the poster is misinformed, at worst, it’s a modern propagation of the old “divide to conquer” strategy.
Found the incel, blindly parroting incel memes in a completely inappropriate context. Not a whole lot of men or women being recruited for the military in their 40s and 50s. But can’t miss a chance to drop those sweet ancient incel memes, eh?
Yes, ad hominem rather than engaging with notion men are disposable in western society. Trully the mark of a civilized, rather than dogmatic individual.
We know why osteoporosis happens, we know why it mostly hits women and we know how to manage the disease besides the wealth of screening and counseling programs. It also happens to affect men. So this entire post is a misinformed piece designed to resurrect the old war of sexes trope. Anything and any war to distract the people from the only war that matters, class war.
Not that I expected a usanian to understand nuanced discussion anyway.
Maybe they just aren’t as easily tricked
