Catholic as far as I know is the only religion where non believer aren’t damned to hell.
So, I did exaggerate a bit sort of. Under Catholism, the virtuous non-beliver and unbaptised innocents go to Limbo, which is not exactly Hell. But Limbo is not a happy place either. It is like an offshoot of hell, minus the explicit pain and punishment of actual hell. It’s residents are described as suffering by their separation from God.
Also Catholics are most definitely not the only religion that doesnt condemn non-believer to hell or the equivalent. There are plenty of religions without even a concept of hell or an analogous eternal punishment, so that’s simply not the case.
The pope doesn’t have influence over leader around the world.
Horseshit. He doesn’t have control, but to pretend that he has no influence is at best ignorant and at worst dishonest.
I mean he ask for the end of war in Gaza or ukraine and look how it goes.
So because violent leaders don’t follow his directives, that means his influence is null?
They never hold scientific progress
They have historically been patrons and stewards of the sciences. However there are moments in history where conflict between doctrine and scientific discovery have led to the church using its overwhelming power to suppress the science and condemn its discoverer(s). Galileo and his Heliocentric model is obviously the most notable of such cases.
Meanwhile Muslim […】
See, you misunderstood the point. My point was about how easy it is to frame facts in a way that makes what would otherwise be seen as normal religious activities and history to us make a religion seem abnormal and menacing in comparison. This was a critique of that framing, not of the Catholic church. You then got super defensive and then doubled down on this framing against Muslims.
Catholicism is fine. Silly but fine. Islam is fine. Silly but fine. More or less all religions are silly but fine until fundamentalists, bigots, jihadists (Muslim or otherwise), theocrats, or or any other prick that uses religion to push their terrible fucking ideas onto others or to justify hurting others gets involved. Islamic states are a problem, no doubt. But frankly any religious theocracy is, and for the exact same reasons.
Under Catholism, the virtuous non-beliver and unbaptised innocents go to Limbo, which is not exactly Hell. But Limbo is not a happy place either. It is like an offshoot of hell, minus the explicit pain and punishment of actual hell. It’s residents are described as suffering by their separation from God.
How can anyone present this nonsense with a straight face? There is no evidence of any of this, some guy made up this wildly implausible story of some invisible realm, so he could preach it to a bunch of gullible dopes, and convince them to give him their money. And those dummies who bought in, now have to convince others to be as stupid as they are, and also give their guy some money.
ALL religion is about taking money from stupid people, and that’s what it’s always been about.
So, I did exaggerate a bit sort of. Under Catholism, the virtuous non-beliver and unbaptised innocents go to Limbo, which is not exactly Hell. But Limbo is not a happy place either. It is like an offshoot of hell, minus the explicit pain and punishment of actual hell. It’s residents are described as suffering by their separation from God.
again you exagerate. The pain come from the separation of god. Not tormenty or anything else. It s describe as happy place but your not complete.
Horseshit. He doesn’t have control, but to pretend that he has no influence is at best ignorant and at worst dishonest.
Give one exemple of his great influence ? Yeah he have some but it doesnt have any ramifications
Galileo and his Heliocentric model is obviously the most notable of such cases.
And that s just misinformation. Galileo wasnt reprimended for his discovery but for having use published it without enough evidence for suporting his claim while he did ask before and that was refuse. He litteraly use church ressource to do something that he was forbiden to do prior.
Catholicism is fine. Silly but fine. Islam is fine. Silly but fine
ok you loose any credibility. U do the basic im super smart since im atheist and i dont believe in god just to loose any credibility by not even be abble to properly criticize. U know what im the first aware that the church (wich isnt the same as the faith) isnt perfect and made a lot of mistake. U framing it as it was comparable to a religion that the literal interpretation allow you do to crime againts mankind is wild and quite horrendous about your knowledge on the subject
I can’t believe people are actually debating this bullshit. How do you debate when you can literally just invent some concept out of thin air, and present it as what God intended? No data, no studies, no historical evidence, everybody just seems really confident in their own personal interpretation of what some - imaginary friend, superpowerful alien entity, invisible life force, whatever - wants from us…or else.
making the point that some imaginary friend tell other they should have right over you cause they dont belive in the imaginary friend when other dont. Compare thoses 2 as equal is missinformed or dishonest
You aren’t a very coherent writer, so I need some clarification. Are you saying that your right to force me to live by your imaginary religious rules, is more valid than my right to live free of your imaginary religious rules?
My rights are based on personal Liberty and Freedom, and you don’t have any right to restrict MY freedoms with YOUR imaginary religious beliefs. Live however ignorantly you want, but you have absolutely no right to impose that on me, nor must I respect it, especially when you are trying to force it on me.
I’m so sick of wildly delusional religious freaks thinking about they have some authority over the rest of us, and if we won’t accept it, they’ll force it on us for our own good, so their Imaginary Friend will be pleased with them.
That s litteraly what il trying to say. Not all religion believe the believer doesn’t have right regarding the non believer. I think it s an important distinction. I never pretend I have right regarding your freedom, contrary to other that will ressort to violence.
Keep up the pedantry and ironic bigotry, dude. Keep on pretending that Catholocism/The Bible doesn’t actively support religious murder, slavery, rape, incest, etc, same as the Islam/Quran. Fine by me.
could u cite me where the bible does those ? before you go and quote me the old testament, that s the jew book. I dont pretend, i know it wich doesnt seem to be the case for you. You can litteraly proove me wrong by just quoting the most well known book of human history. Shouldn’t be hard ?
before you go and quote me the old testament, that s the jew book.
That’s still part of your holy text. The fact that Christians love to shit on the Jews for their book while being it into their own with the lame copout of ‘bUt JeSuS iNvAlIdAtEd It’ while reading out of it at every mass would be hilarious if they weren’t so oblivious to their hypocrisy.
Edited out the hostility, but this is absolutely still bigotry
Yeah and by the new one we shouldnt support them in their sin but that litteraly doesnt give any right to violence toward them. Doesnt seem like being gay in chritian country is worse than in comunist or muslim one for that matter
Doesnt seem like being gay in chritian country is worse than in comunist or muslim one for that matter
Oh, it’s far worse for gays in those other countries, but that’s only because we’ve held you religious freaks at bay for so long. If you get your way, homosexual activity will be criminalized.
you seem eager to judge based on something nobody follow. But go ahead tell me what christian does follow that come from that book and you deem bad
I have no idea what it is you’re saying or trying to ask me.
‘Nobody follows’ the old testament is stupid because that’s literally where half the scripture readings in your masses come from.
I can only assume the second part is trying to ask what of the old testament Christians follow? If so, is like to ask where you think the commandments come from. Otherwise, please try again in readable English.
You can’t cherry pick the good from the bad. Either you don’t care about the old testament and you throw out the ten commandments too, or you accept that half of your book is full of horrific shit you want to ignore.
Funny discounting the old testament with antisemitism while Catholicism is absolutely full of doctrine with no basis in either testament at all. Limbo being a notable example, funnily enough, along with the authority and divinity of the Pope/infallibility of the Holy See, the immaculate birth of Mary, canonized saints, etc. But, sure, pretend like half of your holy book doesn’t matter for Catholics and can’t be held against you, but hold every word of the Quran against every Muslim without an ounce of self-awareness.
funnily enough, along with the authority and divinity of the Pope/infallibility of the Holy See, the immaculate birth of Mary, canonized saints, etc.
Funny how all of these are just tenant of the faith and nothing here allow u to mistreat non beliver.
pretend like half of your holy book doesn’t matter for Catholics and can’t be held against you
I only pretend it was before the new testatment wich by jesus word cancel the old one.
but hold every word of the Quran against every Muslim without an ounce of self-awareness.
Omg he criticise an holly book that allow violence and bunch of shit. We atheist are deeply schock that differents religions can be categorize worse than other. Not a once of self awareness. Idk dude jesus didnt marry an 6yo and did military conquest. If u feel thoses are in the same league im just feel your opinion on the matter dont matter
I only pretend it was before the new testatment wich by jesus word cancel the old one.
“Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them” -Jesus
He added to, iterated on, yes, even changed some laws, but he did not “cancel” the old testament.
Omg […]
I think both books are full of barbarism (with particular emphasis on the old testament in the Bible’s case, though not exclusively) and I don’t respect either one as a guide for morality or way of life. You’re rhe one specifically shitting on the Quran and then pretending half the Bible doesn’t count. Jesus as a model was a pretty good dude and I wish more emulated him. That in no way makes the Bible, as a whole, a good basis for morality. Be like Jesus, book not necessary.
it s cannon but it doesnt hold the same weight. That s why i said that. I can explain to you what s the difference but we keep it simple. yet you can still proove me wrong u have a whole book for that
Right, you effectively reworded your point without addressing anything or supporting your argument in the slightest. I wouldn’t talk shit about reading ability if I were in your shoes. And I’ll be nice and not get into the readability of the content of your post.
That being said, just because you don’t hold it in the same regard as you do the new testament does not invalidate that your religion sees it as part of the holy Scripture, frequently references it in normal courses, and your profit specifically said he didn’t invalidate the previous covenant.
Either way, the old testament is part of your Bible and holds much of the spiritual law used in the religion. Not accepting the barbarism of half your holy text as part of your religion is just pure fucking cope, and laughable as a reformed christian.
So, I did exaggerate a bit sort of. Under Catholism, the virtuous non-beliver and unbaptised innocents go to Limbo, which is not exactly Hell. But Limbo is not a happy place either. It is like an offshoot of hell, minus the explicit pain and punishment of actual hell. It’s residents are described as suffering by their separation from God.
Also Catholics are most definitely not the only religion that doesnt condemn non-believer to hell or the equivalent. There are plenty of religions without even a concept of hell or an analogous eternal punishment, so that’s simply not the case.
Horseshit. He doesn’t have control, but to pretend that he has no influence is at best ignorant and at worst dishonest.
So because violent leaders don’t follow his directives, that means his influence is null?
They have historically been patrons and stewards of the sciences. However there are moments in history where conflict between doctrine and scientific discovery have led to the church using its overwhelming power to suppress the science and condemn its discoverer(s). Galileo and his Heliocentric model is obviously the most notable of such cases.
See, you misunderstood the point. My point was about how easy it is to frame facts in a way that makes what would otherwise be seen as normal religious activities and history to us make a religion seem abnormal and menacing in comparison. This was a critique of that framing, not of the Catholic church. You then got super defensive and then doubled down on this framing against Muslims.
Catholicism is fine. Silly but fine. Islam is fine. Silly but fine. More or less all religions are silly but fine until fundamentalists, bigots, jihadists (Muslim or otherwise), theocrats, or or any other prick that uses religion to push their terrible fucking ideas onto others or to justify hurting others gets involved. Islamic states are a problem, no doubt. But frankly any religious theocracy is, and for the exact same reasons.
How can anyone present this nonsense with a straight face? There is no evidence of any of this, some guy made up this wildly implausible story of some invisible realm, so he could preach it to a bunch of gullible dopes, and convince them to give him their money. And those dummies who bought in, now have to convince others to be as stupid as they are, and also give their guy some money.
ALL religion is about taking money from stupid people, and that’s what it’s always been about.
again you exagerate. The pain come from the separation of god. Not tormenty or anything else. It s describe as happy place but your not complete.
Give one exemple of his great influence ? Yeah he have some but it doesnt have any ramifications
And that s just misinformation. Galileo wasnt reprimended for his discovery but for having use published it without enough evidence for suporting his claim while he did ask before and that was refuse. He litteraly use church ressource to do something that he was forbiden to do prior.
ok you loose any credibility. U do the basic im super smart since im atheist and i dont believe in god just to loose any credibility by not even be abble to properly criticize. U know what im the first aware that the church (wich isnt the same as the faith) isnt perfect and made a lot of mistake. U framing it as it was comparable to a religion that the literal interpretation allow you do to crime againts mankind is wild and quite horrendous about your knowledge on the subject
I can’t believe people are actually debating this bullshit. How do you debate when you can literally just invent some concept out of thin air, and present it as what God intended? No data, no studies, no historical evidence, everybody just seems really confident in their own personal interpretation of what some - imaginary friend, superpowerful alien entity, invisible life force, whatever - wants from us…or else.
making the point that some imaginary friend tell other they should have right over you cause they dont belive in the imaginary friend when other dont. Compare thoses 2 as equal is missinformed or dishonest
You aren’t a very coherent writer, so I need some clarification. Are you saying that your right to force me to live by your imaginary religious rules, is more valid than my right to live free of your imaginary religious rules?
My rights are based on personal Liberty and Freedom, and you don’t have any right to restrict MY freedoms with YOUR imaginary religious beliefs. Live however ignorantly you want, but you have absolutely no right to impose that on me, nor must I respect it, especially when you are trying to force it on me.
I’m so sick of wildly delusional religious freaks thinking about they have some authority over the rest of us, and if we won’t accept it, they’ll force it on us for our own good, so their Imaginary Friend will be pleased with them.
That s litteraly what il trying to say. Not all religion believe the believer doesn’t have right regarding the non believer. I think it s an important distinction. I never pretend I have right regarding your freedom, contrary to other that will ressort to violence.
Keep up the pedantry and ironic bigotry, dude. Keep on pretending that Catholocism/The Bible doesn’t actively support religious murder, slavery, rape, incest, etc, same as the Islam/Quran. Fine by me.
could u cite me where the bible does those ? before you go and quote me the old testament, that s the jew book. I dont pretend, i know it wich doesnt seem to be the case for you. You can litteraly proove me wrong by just quoting the most well known book of human history. Shouldn’t be hard ?
Yikes!
funny how you wont have the same reaction if i say the chirtian book or even the muslim one for that matter
Because they don’t hint at a streak of bigotry, that’s why.
ok ?
That’s still part of your holy text. The fact that Christians love to shit on the Jews for their book while being it into their own with the lame copout of ‘bUt JeSuS iNvAlIdAtEd It’ while reading out of it at every mass would be hilarious if they weren’t so oblivious to their hypocrisy.
Edited out the hostility, but this is absolutely still bigotry
you seem eager to judge based on something nobody follow. But go ahead tell me what christian does follow that come from that book and you deem bad
The entire rationalization for Christian hatred and persecution of gays is derived from the Old Testament, and you guys are devoted to that.
Yeah and by the new one we shouldnt support them in their sin but that litteraly doesnt give any right to violence toward them. Doesnt seem like being gay in chritian country is worse than in comunist or muslim one for that matter
Oh, it’s far worse for gays in those other countries, but that’s only because we’ve held you religious freaks at bay for so long. If you get your way, homosexual activity will be criminalized.
I have no idea what it is you’re saying or trying to ask me.
‘Nobody follows’ the old testament is stupid because that’s literally where half the scripture readings in your masses come from.
I can only assume the second part is trying to ask what of the old testament Christians follow? If so, is like to ask where you think the commandments come from. Otherwise, please try again in readable English.
Are the 10 commandement bad ? What is bad in Christianity that came from the scripture ?
All il trying to say is that your attempt to compare the incomparable doesn’t hold up
You can’t cherry pick the good from the bad. Either you don’t care about the old testament and you throw out the ten commandments too, or you accept that half of your book is full of horrific shit you want to ignore.
With all due respect, no. Christians of all stripes quote the old testament ALLLLLLL the time to justify their actions.
Also, ‘the jew book’? Are you trying to sound antisemitic on top of everything else?
Go back to the harbor, sealion. We’re not doing your homework for you.
so u can proove anything ? right i have no ida why reddit atheist became an insult.
No just that the book doesnt hold the same wieght for different beliefs. if it souns anti semitic i t s a you issue.
Funny discounting the old testament with antisemitism while Catholicism is absolutely full of doctrine with no basis in either testament at all. Limbo being a notable example, funnily enough, along with the authority and divinity of the Pope/infallibility of the Holy See, the immaculate birth of Mary, canonized saints, etc. But, sure, pretend like half of your holy book doesn’t matter for Catholics and can’t be held against you, but hold every word of the Quran against every Muslim without an ounce of self-awareness.
Funny how all of these are just tenant of the faith and nothing here allow u to mistreat non beliver.
I only pretend it was before the new testatment wich by jesus word cancel the old one.
Omg he criticise an holly book that allow violence and bunch of shit. We atheist are deeply schock that differents religions can be categorize worse than other. Not a once of self awareness. Idk dude jesus didnt marry an 6yo and did military conquest. If u feel thoses are in the same league im just feel your opinion on the matter dont matter
“Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them” -Jesus
He added to, iterated on, yes, even changed some laws, but he did not “cancel” the old testament.
I think both books are full of barbarism (with particular emphasis on the old testament in the Bible’s case, though not exclusively) and I don’t respect either one as a guide for morality or way of life. You’re rhe one specifically shitting on the Quran and then pretending half the Bible doesn’t count. Jesus as a model was a pretty good dude and I wish more emulated him. That in no way makes the Bible, as a whole, a good basis for morality. Be like Jesus, book not necessary.
LMAO
Prove me wrong right here in this book, but umm ignore the first half of it, that the church definitely considers canon.
Certainly you can do a better job trolling than that!
it s cannon but it doesnt hold the same weight. That s why i said that. I can explain to you what s the difference but we keep it simple. yet you can still proove me wrong u have a whole book for that
Good job repeating the same thing without addressing anything.
good job not being abble to read
Right, you effectively reworded your point without addressing anything or supporting your argument in the slightest. I wouldn’t talk shit about reading ability if I were in your shoes. And I’ll be nice and not get into the readability of the content of your post.
That being said, just because you don’t hold it in the same regard as you do the new testament does not invalidate that your religion sees it as part of the holy Scripture, frequently references it in normal courses, and your profit specifically said he didn’t invalidate the previous covenant.
Either way, the old testament is part of your Bible and holds much of the spiritual law used in the religion. Not accepting the barbarism of half your holy text as part of your religion is just pure fucking cope, and laughable as a reformed christian.