Funny thing is, that’s what’s called a controlled derailment. It’s the engineering answer to the situatuon, if the situation were real and not a contrived philosophical dilemma.
This guy gets it
Simplistic philosophy for simplistic minds.
It’s not a trolley problem, and even if it were the consequences of greenlighting democratic support for genocide are not fully represented appropriately in this image.
**
It’s close enough to the tracks that it would hurt the hostages, and the wreckage would probably have enough momentum to hit them anyway.
This is a good analogy actually. Blowing up the train would feel good, but that isn’t going to stop the momentum, and it’s unfortunately virtually impossible to outright stop it’s momentum at this point. All that blowing up the train would accomplish is sending fiery wreckage towards the middle track.
This is why accelerationism is stupid.
You’ll have to be more specific about what blowing up the train maps to in real life before I can tell you whether or not doing so would also kill a shit ton of people.
But to keep it in metaphor, there are also innocent people riding the train and blowing it up would kill them, too.
**
stop the trolley, dumb fucks 😂
If you were sitting at the controls that would be an option, but allas we are all just part of those doing a tug of (less or more) war for the switch
Blow up the trolley 👍
You advocate for blowing up the trolley. Okay, what have YOU done to further this idea?
I think the demonic elephant already tied them to the middle track.
Removed by mod
Electoral systems is a pretty nerdy topic (despite how important it is for who gets power), so it is not an issue the typical voter cares for. Therefore there is not enough political capital for such large reforms to be taken on by politicians.
Based on the about of Lemmy comments advocating for it, it seems like the typical voter is pretty passionate about ranked choice voting.
Based on a super niche subset of chronically online youth - this applies to everyone. 🤪
this one is actually really funny, i like this one.
Good shit.
I appreciate OPs honesty that Palestinians are dead either way.
Less palestinians will die under Biden. People who says “how could it be any worse?” have a severe lack of imagination and/or historical knowledge.
Less palestinians will die under Biden.
This claim is absolutely meaningless without evidence and some indication about how the situation resolves.
There’s a very good chance the moment Biden knows he’s won the election he’ll call you Bibi and go “thanks for your patience. Go nuts.”
Trump stoked tensions needlessly by moving US embassy to Jerusalem
I guess people shouldn’t have voted for a terrible candidate in the 2016 DNC primaries.
Lol neoliberals are stroking themselves about how clever this is and just out of view there was another choice back in 2020.
But they like to ignore the fact they voted for a geriatric, procorporate genocide supporting candidates in the 2020 primaries.
What kind of argument is this? “People talking about the current election are ignoring an option that hasn’t existed for 4 years” of course they’re not?! It’s not an option any more! The meme perfectly represents the idiocy of anyone trying to take any kind of moral high ground by not voting. America has made its bed, it sucks but no amount of idealism can change the practical options available to you.
I never claimed any kind of moral high ground. You’re inferring that all on your own.
And I will be voting but I won’t be voting for a strike blocking genocide supporting candidate.
It’s funny you pull the whole “ackshually I never said that” but I never accused you of taking the moral high ground. I just said the meme perfectly captures the idiocy of people taking the moral high ground. You lumped yourself in that category.
Ok bud.
That ship has sailed now bud. Now its trump or biden and that is what the meme is referring to.
“It doesn’t matter that we made terrible decisions that got us here you’re now morally obligated to vote for our strike blocking genocide supporting candidate!”
No. I won’t be voting for Biden, Trump or RFK.
“We”? I’m not even from USA … And I doubt many Lemmy commenters voted for biden in primaries.
Put your big boy pants on and stop whining when people point out that you are wrong morally on a given issue.
Sometimes life isn’t fair 🥲😲
I’m with you on what the meme is trying to say, but the bottom track needs to be shown looping around to the Republican track and running over everyone.
Because that’s where the third track leads.
Yep, not voting is unironically pretty much the same as voting for the party you least want in charge.
Because you’re making it that much more likely.
Don’t throw away a right that your ancestors fought for, as it may result in future generations no longer having that right.
Hitler’s government was a popular government; the vast majority of Germans preferred the rule of gangsters to the effort of thinking and doing for themselves. They abdicated their franchise.
[…]
The former Berlin businessman I referred to earlier told me that he blamed his own group, people with the time and the money and the opportunity to know better, for what happened to Germany. “We ignored Hitler,” he said. “We considered him an unimportant fellow, not quite a gentleman, not of our own class. We considered it just a little bit vulgar to bother with him, to bother with politics at all.”
They thought of the government as “They.” The only possible route to a clear conscience in politics is to accept political responsibility, either as an active member of the party in power or as an equally active member of the loyal opposition.
—Robert A. Heinlein, Take Back Your Government
Like so?
Also, let’s have 'im on the track too.
The problem is that we have two choices, and we will never not have two choices unless we do something about it. I can both say that Joe Biden sucks and we should do better and also vote for him because the other option is worse. This discourse that makes it seem like any criticism of Biden is pro trump is how we will end up in a slightly less terrible place. Cool. Really looking forward to that.
Also like what the fuck…I guess we have to kill Palestinians no matter what.
There is a third fucking option and it’s not doing a genocide.
The problem is that we have two choices
The problem is that we don’t. If you’re not in a “swing” state, all the votes in the world for Joe Biden are meaningless. Win California by another million votes. Win it by another 10M. Have every single eligible voter in California turn up and vote for Joe Biden. He still loses the EC when the SCOTUS tells Arizona to stop counting ballots the minute Trump is in the lead.
Also like what the fuck…I guess we have to kill Palestinians no matter what.
We have to keep sending money to Israel because its the means by which we control the Suez Canal.
Except… the Houthis have control over the back end of the canal so long as they’re able to scare off shipping in the Gulf of Adan. So now we’re endorsing a genocide just for shits and giggles.
It’s almost like two organizations have totally monopolized US politics. It’s a billion dollar industry, and they’d both rather alternate losing to each other and keep their seat at the table than let anyone else play the game.
There is a third fucking option and it’s not doing a genocide.
That’s only an option if you have a viable strategy for accomplishing it.
Which, of course, they don’t. It’s a vanity vote. They want to pretend they have actually done something without actually having to do anything of consequence.
Guys, I don’t know what’s going on in the world and their wars. I just want a president who isn’t abhorently evil. Do we have to revolutionize to find that 3rd option orrr?
I assume your “abhorently evil” comment is based off support of the genocide in Palestine (which is a completely reasonable thing to describe as abhorently evil, I’m just being clear about my premise).
In which case, sorry, bad news, you can’t have that. Your options this time round are genocide supporter or genocide supporter. Somewhere down the line, years from now, the US electoral system may have been sufficiently reformed to make third parties viable. But this year that’s not going to happen.
So that decision is completely out of your hands. But here’s what you do get to decide; you can have an outright fascist, leading a party of outright fascists who have openly publicised their plans to turn your country into a fascist theocracy. Or you can have the guys who strengthened workers rights and went after major companies for union busting, hit Microsoft for $20 billion in back taxes, had the FBI raid a major landlord for illegal price hikes, brought antitrust lawsuits against Amazon and several other large tech firms, and secured billions in aid for Ukraine in their fight for their freedom. And that is literally just a tiny sampling of the good things that Biden’s government has done.
I don’t even see how that’s a choice. One of these two options is clearly and manifestly better than the other, no matter how disgusting it feels. A vote for Biden is not an endorsement of his position on Gaza. It is a tactical choice, nothing more. And if nothing else, its a tactical choice that will prevent the fascists from filling even more seats on the supreme court.
It sucks, but those are the only options. Sometimes life just be like that.
I think the choice is really: Does America deserve the lesser evil?
We can have it for the low price of demanding it. Tell the Democrats you won’t vote for Biden if he doesn’t stop supporting the Israeli genocide.
You realize why the Ashley Biden rape showers with grandpa suddenly became nearly mainstream news and will suddenly go away if Biden does what he’s told?
If that’s how it is then we’ve already lost. People who would make up stories like that would rather take the mask off and destroy democracy then let us get in their way.
Oh, I didn’t say it was made up. That diary seems to be real.
Thats crazy how every government only has two parties
If your point is that the American system is fucked, we all know. We’ve known for decades. We’re trying to fix it, but progress is basically nonexistent, because every politician who is currently elected benefits from our fucked system. Trying to get to a parliamentary system, like most developed real democracies, is almost entirely out of reach. Just getting ranked choice voting is like pulling teeth, and we’ll have to create a brand new party to have politicians free from corporate interests.
I will have to fight all my life to enact positive change in this country, all because a bunch of rich white assholes who came to power long before I was born have stolen my future from me. Don’t belittle us, mourn for us and never, ever repeat our mistakes.
We’re trying to fix it
every politician who is currently elected benefits from our fucked system.
Wild how electing politicians that benefit from the system hasnt fixed the system yet.
Please refrain from speaking on topics that you have no understsnding of
Mean-spirited comment. Downvoted… 🙄
damn and every government got that?
Mainly UK and its derivatives… (USA, Canada, Australia 😄)
If that third track were an option the trolley problem would never have existed. If there really is a third track in the real-life situation, then the trolley problem is not a good analogy of that problem.
Sadly, in this election there is no third track and we are forced into choosing the lesser of two evils.
If you want a third track, push for ranked choice voting!
There literally is a third option that will be printed on most of not all ballots. Rank choice voting is huge but people should be willing to vote earnestly. Nobody wants to be the one to make the change and wants the world to change first but that’s not how it works.
In a FPTP voting system, you cannot vote earnestly. To do so all but guarantees the election of the opposition.
Explanation: https://youtu.be/s7tWHJfhiyo
that video explains well how strategic voting ends up with two parties.
Fun fact. You don’t get the bottom track without demanding it. You end up on the middle track if you negotiate on human rights.
Yup. You also get the middle track when you show up to the 2020 primaries and think to yourself “I’m gonna vote for a geriatric procorporate establishment white man. This is the best decision for me and everyone else will have to accept it because the alternative is Trump.”
Amusing to see commenters who think Biden primary voters are reading forums on Lemmy and are still venting their grudges 4 years later… 🤣
Where do you suppose all the people who voted for Biden in the 2020 primaries congregate?
Definitely not on one of the most marginal, leftleaning comment boards that is lemmy
Liberal yes, left leaning? Doubtful.
Lemmy was literally developed by communists and it feels like every other person here is a socialist.
I think I’ve only ever seen a few people on here call themselves liberals, and that was in the confused American version of the term, I’ve seen liberal used as an insult infinitely more.
Supporting Biden or Ukraine or Israel also does not immediately equal Liberalism, and I have no clue why yall have been treating it like it does.
Yes, liberals will not call themselves liberals. Much like NIMBYS would never call themselves NIMBYS. Especially ones trying to convince leftists to vote for a procorporate genocide supporting trash of a candidate.
I like that, as a nation, we are admitting that we’ll enable the killing of innocent children. It’s important to be honest with ourselves about who we are as a country.
Yes, the US government’s policy is and always has been to support genocidal Israel. That’s why Palestine is on both tracks. There is absolutely nothing voters can do to change this any time soon. You should be focusing on who you can save, rather than who you can’t.
