In all seriousness, it is mostly cis men doing this.
edit: this was meant to be a joke, but honestly the amount of mansplaining in this thread and the responses below this comment has unfortunately altered this into a true statement. What have you all done?
Since men are still getting angry and messaging me:
No I couldn’t, because everyone would think it’s just some white supremacist/manosphere/redpill nonsense, and likely the only people who would show up would be those types anyway.
Literally every other demographic gets their own “spaces” and “identity groups,” and if a white man shows up to those they’re seen as invading where they don’t belong. In mixed-identity spaces, white men are sidelined because they’re the “oppressors” and nobody wants to hear their input, perspective, or opinion. But if white men form an identity group, then everyone assumes it’s about racism and sexism. And if a white man self-isolates, then he gets called an incel and a creep.
There’s literally no good option available other than to be a self-effacing fly on the wall who passively agrees with everything said by a woman or person of color and never critiques, questions, seeks clarity, nor adds nuance.
Women get “women’s spaces,” but “men’s spaces” are to be deplored. BIPOC get “BIPOC spaces,” but “white spaces” are to be abhorred. LGBTQ+ get “queer spaces” but “straight spaces” are to be despised.
And if people say “all spaces are straight white male spaces by default,” then why is it unacceptable to boot anyone else out of those spaces? If someone of a different demographic shows up and starts demanding the narrative/vibe/atmosphere shifts to suit their sensibilities, anyone who doesn’t comply is seen as a racist/sexist/homophobe. But careful not to walk on too many eggshells, because it’s actually offensive to even imply that someone might be easily offended.
Literally the only other option is to hang out in actual racist/sexist/homophobic spaces, which I don’t want to do because I detest those types of people. I just want a space where I can hang out and feel welcome and taken seriously while retaining a modicum of self-respect. But this default view of “white man = oppressor (unless gay)” kinda gets in the way of that. And no one cares if I complain about it, or even believes I could have anything worth complaining about.
That’s what I mean by “white working class men are being excluded from class solidarity.” Maybe don’t force them into racially homogenous echo chambers and movements like trumpism won’t gain any momentum?
Did you miss the part where I said that I don’t either? I’d rather wither away in isolation than hang out with maga types.
In terms of sheer numbers, however, when a large portion of a certain demographic are made to feel rejected from mainstream society, they tend to form a counterculture. In this case, a large portion of the maga base might not have become so vile if they had found validation and acceptance anywhere else. I’m not saying the maga base wouldn’t be vile, but their numbers would be much smaller without anyone to recruit.
Do you have a friend group? Is it culturally diverse? Do you feel respected within it? Or if it’s all white dudes, does anyone ever suggest it’s too homogenous?
Or are you a loner like me? If so, how do you feel about that? Does anyone ever treat you like your isolation is a moral failing on your part?
In terms of sheer numbers, however, when a large portion of a certain demographic are made to feel rejected from mainstream society, they tend to form a counterculture.
Like queer people and people of color and stuff? Agreed. They are marginalized far too often.
In this case, a large portion of the maga base might not have become so vile if they had found validation and acceptance anywhere else.
Those do sound like personal and moral failings. I’m so sad that I’m lonely that imma vote for the racist pedophile. That’ll show em!
I’m not saying the maga base wouldn’t be vile, but their numbers would be much smaller without anyone to recruit.
Their base is so large because there are so many bigots. The Nazi rally in NY? The people throwing rocks at black kids trying to go to school? The ones who murder trans people? Where do you think they went over the course of our nations history? Did they cease to be? Change their ways? Or pass their bullshit down so their kids can do it too, just more in the dl.
Do you have a friend group?
Yes.
Is it culturally diverse?
Yes.
Do you feel respected within it?
Pretty much. That’s why we are friends.
Or if it’s all white dudes, does anyone ever suggest it’s too homogenous?
Lol, why on earth would I only hang out with white men?
Or are you a loner like me?
I’m pretty comfortable being alone because my job is quite social. I love the ability to throw on some tunes when the wife and kids are out of the house and get some work done.
If so, how do you feel about that?
If I was unhappy I would change something. I just moved out of a red state last month and I’m ecstatic. I left behind a bunch of the sorts of racists and other bigots that you’re talking about.
Does anyone ever treat you like your isolation is a moral failing on your part?
Not really. Why would they? Am I being destructive to them or myself? But if it came to that, therapy sounds like a good option.
Fact is, you can blame any minority groups that you want for your personal feelings or failings. Being a bit isolated isn’t, strictly speaking, a moral failing. Turning that anger against people who are already marginalized by society is a wild moral failing. No one has to vote for a rapist and felon because they are sad. People do that when they have gotten over the cognitive dissonance required to become a terrible person.
Life isn’t about never having ups and downs. It is about how we respond to our own bullshit.
The truth is I’m far more worried about my long-term illness than I am about being lonely. I can literally walk into the record/video game/comic store right now and chat it up with people rn.
Well not right now because my body is acting up, but you get the point.
According to this, it’s rural, non-black christians doing this. Men were more likely to vote Trump, but the effect is nowhere near as strong as the urban/rural, christian/atheist and black/non-black divide.
Granted, the billionaires who benefit from this are almost all cis men, but non-billionaire women have been duped nearly the same as much as non-billionaire men.
True. If they didn’t rely on small and unrepresentative samples (or often the imagination of themselves and others) to judge broad population groups and topics of discussion, they by definition wouldn’t be bigots.
Triggering the boys’ club on Lemmy has accidentally become a hobby of mine. All I do is point out misogyny, which there is a lot of on here, and the club decends upon me. At a certain point the downvotes and insults become cathartic because they’re just proving my point. They never even try to convince me that they aren’t misogynists, it’s just pure insults. At least you got some honest discourse mixed in with the bullshit, lol.
As a cis white man, I’m just glad to finally get credit for something. DEI and woke has made it really difficult for me to be rewarded for other people’s progress in spite of my mere passive existence being an active stumbling block in the path of those who made the poor choice of being born as they were.
I’m sorry that you’ve just now realized you exist in a system that connects you to a social order you have little power over, next few months are going to be rough on you I tell’ya.
Although, I wonder if there’s a word for the conditions that someone would have to exist under to make it possible to come this far in life without ever being forced to learn about this because of their advantageous position in that system. 🧐
Because it is an effective distraction from the actual problem which is class war.
Billionaires and their followers are the problem, not people of a certain age, gender, skin colour etc. etc.
In all seriousness, it is mostly cis men doing this.
edit: this was meant to be a joke, but honestly the amount of mansplaining in this thread and the responses below this comment has unfortunately altered this into a true statement. What have you all done?
Since men are still getting angry and messaging me:
You’re doing the thing.
do i get to do the “i swear it’s everyone but me” dance or do you want to do it
I guess “class solidarity” only applies to everyone but cis men.
And then when cis men say their identities are being attacked/invalidated, everyone’s like “nuh uh, you don’t even have an identity!”
If it makes you feel better you could host a parade or gathering or something.
No I couldn’t, because everyone would think it’s just some white supremacist/manosphere/redpill nonsense, and likely the only people who would show up would be those types anyway.
Literally every other demographic gets their own “spaces” and “identity groups,” and if a white man shows up to those they’re seen as invading where they don’t belong. In mixed-identity spaces, white men are sidelined because they’re the “oppressors” and nobody wants to hear their input, perspective, or opinion. But if white men form an identity group, then everyone assumes it’s about racism and sexism. And if a white man self-isolates, then he gets called an incel and a creep.
There’s literally no good option available other than to be a self-effacing fly on the wall who passively agrees with everything said by a woman or person of color and never critiques, questions, seeks clarity, nor adds nuance.
Women get “women’s spaces,” but “men’s spaces” are to be deplored. BIPOC get “BIPOC spaces,” but “white spaces” are to be abhorred. LGBTQ+ get “queer spaces” but “straight spaces” are to be despised.
And if people say “all spaces are straight white male spaces by default,” then why is it unacceptable to boot anyone else out of those spaces? If someone of a different demographic shows up and starts demanding the narrative/vibe/atmosphere shifts to suit their sensibilities, anyone who doesn’t comply is seen as a racist/sexist/homophobe. But careful not to walk on too many eggshells, because it’s actually offensive to even imply that someone might be easily offended.
Literally the only other option is to hang out in actual racist/sexist/homophobic spaces, which I don’t want to do because I detest those types of people. I just want a space where I can hang out and feel welcome and taken seriously while retaining a modicum of self-respect. But this default view of “white man = oppressor (unless gay)” kinda gets in the way of that. And no one cares if I complain about it, or even believes I could have anything worth complaining about.
That’s what I mean by “white working class men are being excluded from class solidarity.” Maybe don’t force them into racially homogenous echo chambers and movements like trumpism won’t gain any momentum?
Lol. “They are making me hang out with racists and homophobes” is a remarkably strange thing to say.
I’m cis and I’ve never felt the need to accommodate racists and homophobes.
Should I feel more attacked?
Did you miss the part where I said that I don’t either? I’d rather wither away in isolation than hang out with maga types.
In terms of sheer numbers, however, when a large portion of a certain demographic are made to feel rejected from mainstream society, they tend to form a counterculture. In this case, a large portion of the maga base might not have become so vile if they had found validation and acceptance anywhere else. I’m not saying the maga base wouldn’t be vile, but their numbers would be much smaller without anyone to recruit.
Do you have a friend group? Is it culturally diverse? Do you feel respected within it? Or if it’s all white dudes, does anyone ever suggest it’s too homogenous?
Or are you a loner like me? If so, how do you feel about that? Does anyone ever treat you like your isolation is a moral failing on your part?
I genuinely would like to know.
Like queer people and people of color and stuff? Agreed. They are marginalized far too often.
Those do sound like personal and moral failings. I’m so sad that I’m lonely that imma vote for the racist pedophile. That’ll show em!
Their base is so large because there are so many bigots. The Nazi rally in NY? The people throwing rocks at black kids trying to go to school? The ones who murder trans people? Where do you think they went over the course of our nations history? Did they cease to be? Change their ways? Or pass their bullshit down so their kids can do it too, just more in the dl.
Yes.
Yes.
Pretty much. That’s why we are friends.
Lol, why on earth would I only hang out with white men?
I’m pretty comfortable being alone because my job is quite social. I love the ability to throw on some tunes when the wife and kids are out of the house and get some work done.
If I was unhappy I would change something. I just moved out of a red state last month and I’m ecstatic. I left behind a bunch of the sorts of racists and other bigots that you’re talking about.
Not really. Why would they? Am I being destructive to them or myself? But if it came to that, therapy sounds like a good option.
Fact is, you can blame any minority groups that you want for your personal feelings or failings. Being a bit isolated isn’t, strictly speaking, a moral failing. Turning that anger against people who are already marginalized by society is a wild moral failing. No one has to vote for a rapist and felon because they are sad. People do that when they have gotten over the cognitive dissonance required to become a terrible person.
Life isn’t about never having ups and downs. It is about how we respond to our own bullshit.
The truth is I’m far more worried about my long-term illness than I am about being lonely. I can literally walk into the record/video game/comic store right now and chat it up with people rn.
Well not right now because my body is acting up, but you get the point.
Oh, is that the joke?
According to exit polls, no it’s not.
e.g. https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2025/06/26/voting-patterns-in-the-2024-election/
According to this, it’s rural, non-black christians doing this. Men were more likely to vote Trump, but the effect is nowhere near as strong as the urban/rural, christian/atheist and black/non-black divide.
Granted, the billionaires who benefit from this are almost all cis men, but non-billionaire women have been duped nearly the same as much as non-billionaire men.
Statistics don’t matter to bigots.
True. If they didn’t rely on small and unrepresentative samples (or often the imagination of themselves and others) to judge broad population groups and topics of discussion, they by definition wouldn’t be bigots.
Well that isn’t 100% true. There’s a bunch that like to parrot b******* crime statistics.
Okay, this was a joke but saying its bigoted to make fun of cis men is a new level of fragile masculinity
Triggering the boys’ club on Lemmy has accidentally become a hobby of mine. All I do is point out misogyny, which there is a lot of on here, and the club decends upon me. At a certain point the downvotes and insults become cathartic because they’re just proving my point. They never even try to convince me that they aren’t misogynists, it’s just pure insults. At least you got some honest discourse mixed in with the bullshit, lol.
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As a cis white man, I’m just glad to finally get credit for something. DEI and woke has made it really difficult for me to be rewarded for other people’s progress in spite of my mere passive existence being an active stumbling block in the path of those who made the poor choice of being born as they were.
I’m sorry that you’ve just now realized you exist in a system that connects you to a social order you have little power over, next few months are going to be rough on you I tell’ya.
Although, I wonder if there’s a word for the conditions that someone would have to exist under to make it possible to come this far in life without ever being forced to learn about this because of their advantageous position in that system. 🧐
I appreciate your apologies. Few people realize how hard it is to be given every advantage, but not have everything.
Ok, I’m done. These sarcastic comments are making me sad.
The answer was “privilege”