- cross-posted to:
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- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
cross-posted from: https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/49868866
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For any who need to hear it: it takes courage to ask for help, you are not weak, you are strong. Don’t be like previous generations and bottle that shit up, it just comes out in the worst ways.
told to be stoic, strong and never cry?
Do you live in the 50’s?
Now it’s the complete oppositeIt really isn’t.
You’re mostly right. With a lot of people, yes, you can be open and honest and you’ll be met with love and understanding. But it’s a minority in my experience.
With the majority, you get a “men should be socially aware and emotionally available” but then the second you bring up your own feelings and problems, you’re ignored. Possibly even get your admission of “weakness” mocked.
The assumption is that as a man you have it good, are set for life, and so you don’t get to complain. Any problems you have must be minor and should be easy to deal with, how dare you try enlist help from others. Suck it up and man up!
It’s popular to virtue-signal about how society thinks about men, so it might seem like things are better. And they are. But there is STILL a double-standard that is making it very difficult to discuss with most people.
When meeting people one on one, the toxic masculinity is alive and well. No-one mocks me to my face at a party. But one on one? All the time.
I think, and hope, that is your personal opinion.
Could be the specific society you live in.
Maybe I’m lucky that way.
Sorry it isn’t a thing of the past for you, it is never OK to mock someone and I or the peole I know will never accept this.
And neither should you.I don’t consider it just an opinion. I’ve heard of similar experiences from too many others.
I want to stress that I do know a ton people who are past this type of thinking, but it feels like I have to sift through a hundred persons to find one worth knowing.
If I stay within my known-good circle, it’s fine. Great, even. But the moment I try to meet new people, men and women, I instantly get slapped in the face with how things really are.
As for whether it’s a thing in the local culture, maybe. I’m finnish. We’re progressive in a ton of ways but this isn’t one of them.
Finnish might be a reason.
The very few I met were pretty closed and reserved.
Like Katri, a girl who came for studies.
We called her the ice queen, so that says a lot.
Took some time to get trough the ice.Unrelated.
We are extremely social, with a big initial wall. We don’t do small talk or other forms of disingenuine pleasantries. I consider that stuff completely normal and not a problem.
In fact I like it. And I’m not talking about how people act to maintain that initial wall. I’m more than used to that stuff, being finnish myself. No decent person does it by saying things they don’t believe, or by treating you like crap.
I’m talking about what people actually think on a cultural level. Stuff they say and do without meaning to do harm. Even after you get to know them. The expectations you are faced with as a man, when you start a relationship or start working with new people.
When I say men are mocked for showing weakness, I mean people who do it because it doesn’t do anything to the man in question. As if his mental state and confidence is unshakable by default, making their words just harmless fun. Becayse he’s a man. He can take it.
I guess we need more empathy
I’m glad you feel that the emotional state of men is better support. Genuinely pleased if your social circle/work/community/family are like this. But this is certainly not standard and certainly not “the complete opposite”.
I’m sure that for a substancial period already the youth gets educated about this.
I referenced the 50’s since they had all the archaic hierarchical cliche’s like the man providing for his family, etc…
I think we have moved on from there.
There will always be reactionary people and yes there is the manosphere social media BS but honestly I have encountered none of that.
Even with some I didn’t expect it like a welder “tough guy” I know.
So it might be different for you but my experience with this issue is totally positive.
Might depend on the country, religion or other factors.It’s not only society and other men creating some sort of toxic environmental soup where emotions are ridiculed.
A lot of men are hard wired to be solitary and self-sufficient. It’s like a genetic survival thing that persists even though community and society are the lynchpins of human survival.
When a “strong silent type” is doing their thing, they often really are strong and can get by without anyone else, but when the inevitable cracks start to show, they haven’t fostered the support systems that most people have around them. These guys will suffer in silence and it can cost them their health and their lives because they have encountered a problem they are unable to resolve and they don’t have anyone to turn to.
It’s definitely less common than it used to be, and support systems are definitely more readily available, but it’s still there, and there are still people who will try to gut it out when they really should seek help.
I know a guy like that.
A good friend actually, quiet, super nice and always ready to help anyone.
He took a lot of shit from bosses, landlords etc… a lot of stress.
Couldn’t get how he handled it, often said he needed to react when something happened for his own good but he just let it go every time, like some buddhist monk.
One time in a bar during a stressful period a little thing pushed him over the edge.
Totally snapped and wanted to fight everyone.
Nobody could believe how he was in that moment. I had to drag him out to calm him down.
Took some time to get him out of his fury but at once he broke and started crying on my shoulder.
It was also a lesson for me.
Just being available isn’t enough.
With some people you need tobe more attentive, read the small signs and get them to talk, they won’t do it by themselves even if they know they can.
Ask those red-pilled andrew tate bootlicking alpha sigma gymbros
I don’t know any of these clowns since that’s a fringe part of society. Let them dig their own graves.
If only it was fringe
Like I said, literally haven’t met a single one of them.
And would be hard to miss with the laughably macho attitude I see online from these types.
I have no data on how many there are supposed to be, will probably depend on where you live.
This sounds like a US thing with it’s backward ways, conservative and religious influences, etc.
On other continents I suspect India or islamic regions are also prone to it.Eastern Europe
Or really any country that isn’t in western europe
I cri evry tiem.
