It’s not a red herring. Religious people don’t treat god like some social concept that doesn’t physically exist but still plays a role in how we interact in our society. They claim their god literally exists.
People claim money actually exists, too. It’s not an inherent property of human existence. It’s just an organizing principle that helps us coordinate resources.
It would be stupid if the main argument we had about money was whether on not it “exists.” By “stupid” I mean that it is counterproductive to the goals of bettering humanity. We don’t get anywhere with that discussion. Instead, we talk about how we should use use money as a tool to better organize our society. We talk about equity and advancement and poverty.
It’s the same with religion. It’s been well studied that religion offers social benefits:
With this being Lemmy, I don’t have to highlight the negative consequences of religion.
The point is that we should be advancing beyond the kindergarten level discussion about what’s real and what’s make-believe. Intelligent people should instead be engaging on how we can ensure religious beliefs are fostering social trust, or how to recognize and combat religious extremism.
Who is arguing that money existed before people invented it? Who is arguing that America existed before 1776? The issue with God is people are arguing that it is not just a human invention, but in fact that humanity is an invention of God. Which is in direct conflict of our scientific understanding of the world around us which leads to a variety of issues. I have no idea what point you’re trying to make. Is it that made up things can have real influence? Sure, I don’t think anyone would disagree. But the difference is I use all sorts of things humans made up, I know they made up, but they are useful. If I started to argue that currency has existed since before the dawn of the universe you’d say I had a mental condition
Those “social benefits” are band-aids needed because of a non-functioning government solution like a non-fath based welfare state. The reason you don’t see them as much in functioning countries, is because they are needed much less.
I’m not saying all religious people do but it’s significant enough to warrant discussions like these and it comes off as incredibly disengenuous to pivot to “well actually spirituality is quite good for people” because that’s not what’s being discussed.
It’s not a red herring. Religious people don’t treat god like some social concept that doesn’t physically exist but still plays a role in how we interact in our society. They claim their god literally exists.
People claim money actually exists, too. It’s not an inherent property of human existence. It’s just an organizing principle that helps us coordinate resources.
It would be stupid if the main argument we had about money was whether on not it “exists.” By “stupid” I mean that it is counterproductive to the goals of bettering humanity. We don’t get anywhere with that discussion. Instead, we talk about how we should use use money as a tool to better organize our society. We talk about equity and advancement and poverty.
It’s the same with religion. It’s been well studied that religion offers social benefits:
Association between spirituality/religiousness and quality of life 2021
Assessing the Faith-Based Response to Homelessness in America
63.2% food pantries are identified as being faith-based food pantries
With this being Lemmy, I don’t have to highlight the negative consequences of religion.
The point is that we should be advancing beyond the kindergarten level discussion about what’s real and what’s make-believe. Intelligent people should instead be engaging on how we can ensure religious beliefs are fostering social trust, or how to recognize and combat religious extremism.
Who is arguing that money existed before people invented it? Who is arguing that America existed before 1776? The issue with God is people are arguing that it is not just a human invention, but in fact that humanity is an invention of God. Which is in direct conflict of our scientific understanding of the world around us which leads to a variety of issues. I have no idea what point you’re trying to make. Is it that made up things can have real influence? Sure, I don’t think anyone would disagree. But the difference is I use all sorts of things humans made up, I know they made up, but they are useful. If I started to argue that currency has existed since before the dawn of the universe you’d say I had a mental condition
Those “social benefits” are band-aids needed because of a non-functioning government solution like a non-fath based welfare state. The reason you don’t see them as much in functioning countries, is because they are needed much less.
But people don’t just argue that spirituality itself is a useful tool. They straight up say their religion is true. Those are not the same things.
Are you saying that or “people” are? You are making very wide assumptions about religious people.
I’m not saying all religious people do but it’s significant enough to warrant discussions like these and it comes off as incredibly disengenuous to pivot to “well actually spirituality is quite good for people” because that’s not what’s being discussed.