- Protecting an Abuser: Leaders of a Minnesota church didn’t report a parishioner to police though they knew he’d sexually abused girls for years and had been told reporting it was their duty.
- Forgive and Forget: Church leaders held meetings where children were told to forgive the man who sexually abused them and forget the abuse. If they spoke of it, the sin would be theirs.
- Missed Opportunities: Prosecutors had at least one opportunity to intervene but hoped educating church leaders about their duties would encourage them to cooperate with authorities.
Hope they told that preacher to go ride the devils dick
He might actually enjoy that.
Look, they have faith in god, and god is totally real, but we have to separate the religious people from those who are delusional, naive, hateful, or are using religion for their own gain.
The best way to do this is to let god, who is definitely, totally real, to choose who he favours.
So instead of a baptism we just have anyone who is following the lord leap off a cliff. God will save the ones that are actually religious, and we won’t have to worry about the rest of the bad ones.
The great thing is that this works for every belief system that maintains the existence of any kind of remotely sapient higher power.
I feel like the rotten brains out there who only know scrolling can no longer detect even a hint of sarcasm unless ChatGTP tells them that it’s a joke.
No wonder they’re okay having a pedo president.
One of the priests at the Catholic school/church I went to was a family friend.
Years later it came out that he had been abusing an altar boy who was just 1 grade behind me. I’d see this kid all the time.
When my mom told me he had been arrested and why, she said “But don’t tell anyone” - because he was “a friend”.
I said bullshit - I’m telling everybody I see.
He’s in prison forever now but that poor kid…and that’s just the one I know about.
There was a pedophile priest who had the parents of a boy he molested complain to the bishop. The bishop, in his wisdom, moved him to be a teacher in my school. An all-boys boarding school. A few years after I was there, he was convicted of molesting a boy at the school, as well as the original case. His sentence was 2 years of probation. He died in his 90s just a couple of years ago, and his obituary was full of praise and warm memories.
Meanwhile, one of the boys in my class who I now can see was being groomed by this priest, took his own life before he was 50, after what was described as a very difficult life. I think it’s pretty obvious why.
In the 40+ years since I left that high school, no one from the school or the diocese has ever contacted me or my family to see if we saw or experienced any abuse.
If I learn a “friend” abused a kid… They’re not my friend anymore, and likely never will be again
A friend isn’t a sacred thing, if someone turns out to be a piece of shit, I drop them like a stone. They’re dead to me. I will never excuse someone’s abhorrent behaviour like that. To still stay friends with them and maybe even excuse or hide what they did… is unthinkable to me
I said bullshit - I’m telling everybody I see.
Good on you.
In front of the girl, her father and Bruckelmyer, Massie asked her for forgiveness. Looming over her, the three men wept. Then the girl’s dad and preacher allowed the man who had been sexually abusing her since kindergarten to hug her.
In accordance with one of the core tenets of their church, the matter was resolved. It was forgiven. It should now be forgotten. If she spoke of it again, she would be guilty of having an unforgiving heart and the sins would become hers.
What is this shit?
Religion is for grifters and morons.
If they’re not making money off of it, you know which one they are.
Gaslighting. It’s gaslighting the poor girl into obedience. Never be afraid to name names of anyone who threatens, tries, or does abuse you. The “sin” is theirs and will always be theirs, and if you remain silent they are free to sin again and ask forgiveness.
That’s organized religion.
I’ll preface this with that I’m not a believing Christian, I don’t even believe in God. But I grew up with religious grand-parents and also had religious education since childhood from talking to our town priest at various summer camps that were organized and supervised by the church. I was that weird kid that always asked too many questions.
It’s one of those attempts at bible-thumping that is just abhorrent and completely wrong.
In Christian belief (more strongly held to by catholic branches of Christianity), Jesus endured torture, insults and death and in return, he only wished for salvation for everyone (including the people insulting, torturing and killing him). Jesus did this because he knew that the only entity that is allowed to judge you is God and God will judge you when you die and by enduring the atrocities committed against him, he showed faith in God’s fair judgement.
Technically, that means that seeking revenge or justice for a crime committed against you is equal to not trusting in God to judge your perpetrator(s) fairly in afterlife and as such is not living the example that Jesus gave. Instead, you should forgive and pray and hope that your abuser will understand and repent his wrongdoings.
It does however not transfer their sin onto you, you are committing a different sin in doing so, so they keep their sin of being a childfucker, so what these kooks are saying is baloney. It’s also entirely unchristian to demand absolution from anyone but God and it’s a sin doing so. As a victim, it’s also allowed to think about and voice your anger and frustration of crimes committed against you, you should just not act upon your anger irrationally. Suing somebody for damages is not irrational, telling them to fuck off and never come near you ever again is not irrational, so they are plainly wrong.
Too that, I would say seek retribution and let God sort them out. If it’s good for the gander, it’s good for the goose.
Uber Christian bull shit
Fuck all religions
If an atheist abuses a kid should we fuck atheism too?
If you ignore history and want to falsely equivocate the two, then sure, whatever floats your boat.
All religions are death cults
Once again, not a drag queen.
But forgiving drag queens is wrong despite Galatians 3:28 in the New Testament:
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Never is.
They don’t like drag queens because the drag queens might teach their kids to be literate.
I wouldn’t say never, after all Rudy Giuliani has done drag, and there was that time he got caught in a hotel room with someone he thought was 15 and his hand down his pants.
I don’t think cross dressing a few times qualifies him to be a drag queen any more than changing a headlight makes someone a mechanic.
Don’t forget when members of IDF cross-dressed, and went into a hospital to kill some people.
The Laestadian sect from my neck of the woods are big on forgiveness. If I had a quarter for every time this story has surfaced, I’d have a nice mixed bag of beers for the weekend. I might get alcohol poisoning if I had a quarter for all the stories that never surfaced.
Happens all the time. Especially the more fundamentalist you get.
Are church leaders mandated reporters in Minnesota?
According to this site MN mandated reporting they might be:
People who must report
Anyone who is a professional or a professional’s delegate engaged in the practice of the healing arts, social services, hospital administration, psychological or psychiatric treatment, child care, education, law enforcement, or employed as a member of the clergy.
I say might be because it states “employed as a member of the clergy”. I’m betting they would claim “everyone who knew” was a volunteer (i.e. not “employed”).
I’m a member of a Christian organized religion. I don’t think Christianity itself is to blame; PERVERSION OF CHRISTIANITY IS, but not Christinaty itself.
Any true Christian would report this (doesn’t matter if they are legally required to or not). I’m not willing to stand in front of St Peter & God on judgement day and try to defend that kind of inaction.
They should have many years in prison to work to atone for that.
The article says it was required:
But they never reported Massie’s crimes to police, as required by the law. Instead, Bruckelmyer and other leaders in the church encouraged the victims to take part in forgiveness sessions — which allowed Massie, now 50, to continue abusing children, according to an investigation by the Minnesota Star Tribune and ProPublica.
Later down:
He said it was up to the victims to report the crimes to police, a clear misreading of the law for mandated reporters — doctors, teachers and others who are required to report crimes against children.
“We don’t protect either one,” Bruckelmyer said of sexual abusers and their victims.
This is the churches defense:
Kimberly Lowe, a lawyer and crisis manager for the church, said its preachers are unpaid and therefore might not be legally required to report sexual abuse of children. Asked if she believes the preachers are mandated reporters under Minnesota law, Lowe would only say that the language of the statute is unclear.
Propublica does pretty deep research, so I’m inclined to believe them.
It sounds like we are agreeing.
What I said above:
I say might be because it states “employed as a member of the clergy”. I’m betting they would claim “everyone who knew” was a volunteer (i.e. not “employed”).
What your post above states (I added some bold and italic for emphasis in your quote):
This is the churches defense:
Kimberly Lowe, a lawyer and crisis manager for the church, said its preachers are unpaid and therefore might not be legally required to report sexual abuse of children. Asked if she believes the preachers are mandated reporters under Minnesota law, Lowe would only say that the language of the statute is unclear.
While I agree the Propublica article states they were required reporters and that organization does pretty deep research, I was pointing out the “lawyer way of splitting hairs” in my comments. Lawyers just love to define and redefine the meanings of words; argue about context; question “what was the ‘real intent of the legislation’”; sow doubt; faine ignorance; beg forgiveness; etc ad nauseum. That’s why lawyers are hired to defend in court. Nothing against Propublica but you wouldn’t hire them to defend in court - they are after truth, in court you want a defense which is not necessarily the truth.
Please note: none of this is meant to be “against you/your comments”. Just a slightly different angle on the subject.
Best wishes to all and I hope we can get closer to making this kind of thing just an unhappy part of history.
What does that even mean?
Mandated reporters are people that are legally required to report abuse or suspected abuse. Teachers, social workers, physicians, etc.
Are they anywhere?
If repenting to a priest isn’t good enough in all cases, the idea of always being redeemable to enter heaven crumbles. They can’t have that. No shit they aren’t reporting. They’d lose subscribers.
