all existing Nvidia systems suddenly disappeared because Linus said something somewhere
Sure, if I would buy/upgrade my PC now, I would go AMD for the graphics - it’s just less hassle this way, and open drivers are nice to have.
But it just so happened that I purchased my PC 5 years before I switched to Linux. It’s a perfectly functional machine I don’t feel the need to replace, and with many people coming over from Windows right now amid Windows 10 support termination, many more find themselves in a similar situation.
Building a new PC just for Linux is expensive, stupid, and not ecologically conscious. As Linux shows itself as a more democratic and old hardware-friendly option, supporting Nvidia GPUs, old or new, is a must, even if Nvidia itself gets hostile at times.
You make it look like old Nvidia cards are the only reason X11 is held around.
Heck, I had trouble installing remote desktop for my work (they use Omnissa Horizon) on Fedora, because the app still exclusively supports X11, and Fedora removed it in version 42.
There are plenty of instances of similar things happening here and there, and currently, ditching X11 will still be catastrophic for many users’ workflows.
Heck, I had trouble installing remote desktop for my work (they use Omnissa Horizon) on Fedora, because the app still exclusively supports X11, and Fedora removed it in version 42.
X11 applications still run under XWayland. The X11 session is gone, not all compatibility with X11 applications. Steam wouldn’t run if complete removal was the case.
What’s Omnissa’s stance there? Will they port their application? Will they hire a developer to maintain a X11 session?
ditching X11 will still be catastrophic for many users’ workflows.
Are these users hiring a developer to maintain the X11 session? If not, they need to adapt then and go with the times and migrate to other solutions. RustDesk supports Wayland just fine, for example.
Somehow with XWayland enabled, the app still specifically demanded an actual X11 session
I guess it’s because Horizon can probably act as a host to control the desktop and as client to control other desktop. The latter should work with XWayland, the former not. As I wrote: RustDesk works just fine. What RustDesk doesn’t currently offer with Wayland is unattended access. The desktop that’s about to be remote controlled gets a question to confirm remote access, at least under Gnome.
My somewhat educated guess is that it’s more likely that Gnome’s permission system gets a “always allow remote access” button before a X11 application gets a Wayland port when the decade until now a Wayland port was no priority.
RustDesk could be a brilliant option, but the company is huge and there’s little chance to alter management decisions of this magnitude. This would take a lot of work on IT team, and as of right now, they can’t even care to update what they have, featuring outdated clients because they somehow “work better”.
But anyway, thanks for advice! Could be useful for my own projects.
Both Wayland & Linux try to support Nvidia, but Nvidia wasn’t cooperating. Software, especially software as big as DEs can’t stay tied to old tech & hardware forever.
I’d say GNOME kept X11 around for long enough and Linux worked hard on supporting old fussy hardware.
all existing Nvidia systems suddenly disappeared because Linus said something somewhere
Sure, if I would buy/upgrade my PC now, I would go AMD for the graphics - it’s just less hassle this way, and open drivers are nice to have.
But it just so happened that I purchased my PC 5 years before I switched to Linux. It’s a perfectly functional machine I don’t feel the need to replace, and with many people coming over from Windows right now amid Windows 10 support termination, many more find themselves in a similar situation.
Building a new PC just for Linux is expensive, stupid, and not ecologically conscious. As Linux shows itself as a more democratic and old hardware-friendly option, supporting Nvidia GPUs, old or new, is a must, even if Nvidia itself gets hostile at times.
It’s not up to Linux “to support Nvidia”, it’s up to Nvidia to properly support Linux.
Ideally, yes. But if Nvidia is stubborn, there are two ways to go about it:
So keeping the X11 session around for a decade after Intel and Radeon had their drivers ready is “not do anything to support Nvidia users”?
Who is paying for this task? Have NVidia users set up a pledge drive? Did any PC manufacturer?
You make it look like old Nvidia cards are the only reason X11 is held around.
Heck, I had trouble installing remote desktop for my work (they use Omnissa Horizon) on Fedora, because the app still exclusively supports X11, and Fedora removed it in version 42.
There are plenty of instances of similar things happening here and there, and currently, ditching X11 will still be catastrophic for many users’ workflows.
X11 applications still run under XWayland. The X11 session is gone, not all compatibility with X11 applications. Steam wouldn’t run if complete removal was the case.
What’s Omnissa’s stance there? Will they port their application? Will they hire a developer to maintain a X11 session?
Are these users hiring a developer to maintain the X11 session? If not, they need to adapt then and go with the times and migrate to other solutions. RustDesk supports Wayland just fine, for example.
Somehow with XWayland enabled, the app still specifically demanded an actual X11 session
They promise it will be done, but they already moved the dates several times
Migration would be great, but it’s not sometching an individual employee can do of an employer uses what it uses.
I guess it’s because Horizon can probably act as a host to control the desktop and as client to control other desktop. The latter should work with XWayland, the former not. As I wrote: RustDesk works just fine. What RustDesk doesn’t currently offer with Wayland is unattended access. The desktop that’s about to be remote controlled gets a question to confirm remote access, at least under Gnome.
My somewhat educated guess is that it’s more likely that Gnome’s permission system gets a “always allow remote access” button before a X11 application gets a Wayland port when the decade until now a Wayland port was no priority.
RustDesk could be a brilliant option, but the company is huge and there’s little chance to alter management decisions of this magnitude. This would take a lot of work on IT team, and as of right now, they can’t even care to update what they have, featuring outdated clients because they somehow “work better”.
But anyway, thanks for advice! Could be useful for my own projects.
Both Wayland & Linux try to support Nvidia, but Nvidia wasn’t cooperating. Software, especially software as big as DEs can’t stay tied to old tech & hardware forever.
I’d say GNOME kept X11 around for long enough and Linux worked hard on supporting old fussy hardware.