- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
- cross-posted to:
- [email protected]
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“My economy is DYING! PLEASE help me budget this ASAP: Infrastructure: $20/ Education: $30/ Health: $25/ Azov thirst trap posters: $50 bil/ Giant Meat Grinder: $150 bil”/ “Can you cut the meat grinder?”/ “NO!”
Anything but peacetalks, I see.
there’s no money in peace talks
Peace talks as in, just give Putin what he wants? How is it hard to see that people do not like to be conquered…
Ah lemme cross “thinks everything started in 2022” and “thinks Putin runs the entire government” off my Ukraine lib bingo card here I swear that first one is a free space every time
need a copy of this bingo card
Copypasta time. I think this thing has another year or two of mileage. I’ll make sure to circle back and laugh at you when Ukrainian Nazis are dragged out and shot in Kiev. Ukraine as it is would be better off as a occupied Russian territory than a NATO launching point and a banderite/Nazi infested military base. Slabba Poopani!
@я_не_из_калининграда@lemmy.ml (not a native english speaker, I believe)
i do not support the current administrations internal actions, as capitalism has brought nothing but injustice, suffering, poverty, crime and corruption. but i absolutely do support its foreign policy, especially regarding the ukrainian question. the putin government has evolved to become one of the most effective anti-imperialist forces on the planet and even if you ignore the terrible nature of the terrorist zelensky-regime one has to be grateful to our military for fighting the biggest enemy of mankind, america.
so lets detail the happenings that led to the current situation:
(it may be important to note that the current russian administration pushes a slightly different narrative due to sadly being a right wing state)
banderite collaborators parading in front of nazi officers the banderites (see picture), members of the fascist “organization of ukrainian nationalists” led by stepan andreyevich bandera were a gang of rapists and murderers who collaborated with the invading german hordes and assisted them by conducting acts of terror against civilians. It is important to note that popular support for them was close to zero. after the victory of the heroic red army, the majority of those parasites fled to the west, predominantly to canada. they received funding from american and british intelligence agencies, which were more than happy to welcome “former” nazis into their own anti-communist ranks. another subset of the banderites remained in the ukrainian ssr and conducted a campaign of terror and sabotage against the civilian population. their bloody deeds were supported by the cia and its european puppet agencies through the so called “operation aerodynamic”.
spoiler
referendum on the preservation of the ussr. its results were ignored by the anti-communists
After the illegal and undemocratic dissolution of the ussr, the leaders of those fascist gangs were glorified by the ukrainian far-right, with support from the cia. efforts to further their “rehabilitation” were primarily directed by nazi expatriates in canada. outlets such as voice of america portrayed them as “heroes”. (aerodynamic, some of these were manufactured in the U.S under Operation Mockingbird like a lot of U.S state dept. bullshit)
election before cia intervention. this division between neonazi northwest and pro-russian southeast is visible to this day
in 2004, the west sabotaged the ukrainian presidential elections and installed their puppet, viktor andreyevich yushchenko, through a color revolution. he was a terrible leader, not only dismantling the remaining aspects of the ukrainian economy and managing to make life even more miserable than it already was, but also granting “hero of ukraine” status to banderite leaders and holocaust perpetrators stepan bandera and roman iosifovich shukhevich.
(not adding picture of 2014 ukrainian nazis since you have already said you believe in that)
in 2014, america and the west orchestrated another coup, this time not even bothering to hide the involvement of neo-nazis. the new regime perpetrated unspeakable atrocities against the russian population, whom it consideres “subhuman,” as well as against ukrainian anti-fascists. in odessa alone, 39 people were burned alive in the local trade union building.
those developments led to the revolution in the predominantly russian populated donbass-area and the creation off the donetsk and lugansk peoples republics, as well as the referendum in crimea that led to the peninsula finally rejoining russia. from 2014 till 2022 the majority of humanitarian aid to the donbass republics came from the cprf.
the reason for the smo is the ukrainian western-aligned nazi regime violating the minsk accords by refusing to demilitarize, trying to join the fascist nato-block and murdering russian civilians for years on end. the russian government showed itself extremely lenient, to lenient even, as any sensible politician would have staged a military intervention much earlier. if you need further proof for the tyrannical nature of the kievan regime just look at the fact that zelenskiy has banned all opposition parties in his country, refuses to hold elections and effectively rules as a military dictator. furthermore he has outlawed the russian language, made any negotiation with the russian state illegal and is currently selling whatever is left of his country to the highest bidder. combine all this with the fact that the west and its puppets need to always be opposed due to them being a cancer of humanity and you’ll get a pretty good picture of why to support the russian military.
[Query: Do communists have to support Russia?]
from @[email protected]
In a word, no. In a few more words, support for Russia (not Putin, as historical materialists don’t subscribe to great man theory) is only a partial, temporary, tactical one, in the context of imperialist liberation. Russia is still a capitalist state, though, so it’s a two stage strategy: first liberate colonized bourgeois states from colonizer states, and second revolution within those liberated bourgeois states.
Russia is an interesting case: it has already liberated itself from the post-Soviet “shock therapy” neocolonizers. This occurred during Putin’s administration, which is why he is especially hated by the US. So now the support for Russia is in the context of keeping the colonizers from recolonizing it, and supporting Russia to the extent that it helps other states liberate themselves. But Russia isn’t trying to “liberate” Ukraine, at least not all of Ukraine. It’s trying to resolve the genocidal attacks on the people of the Donbas, and it’s trying to resolve the imperialist military expansion at its border.
Also, Ukraine really does have a fascism problem and has for a long time, and the coup government has materially supported it.
- BBC, 2014: Ukraine underplays role of far right in conflict
- Human Rights Watch, 2014: Ukraine: Unguided Rockets Killing Civilians
- The Hill, 2017: The reality of neo-Nazis in Ukraine is far from Kremlin propaganda
- The Guardian, 2017: ‘I want to bring up a warrior’: Ukraine’s far-right children’s camp – video
- WaPo, 2018: The war in Ukraine is more devastating than you know
- Reuters, 2018: Ukraine’s neo-Nazi problem
- The Nation, 2019: Neo-Nazis and the Far Right Are On the March in Ukraine
- openDemocracy, 2019: Why Ukraine’s new language law will have long-term consequences
- Jacobin, 2022: A US-Backed, Far Right–Led Revolution in Ukraine Helped Bring Us to the Brink of War
- Consortium News, 2022: Evidence of US-Backed Coup in Kiev
- Al Jazeera, 2022: Why did Ukraine suspend 11 ‘pro-Russia’ parties?
- History of Fascism in Ukraine: Part I, Part II, Part III, Part IV
next source is from @[email protected] below -
Gonna need to see your source for support to keep fighting from the Ukrainian people, it’s not 2022 anymore buddy
You need to see a source for ukraine having the right to defend themselves? Tough luck.
Ukraine doesn’t have the right to defend itself, not when it started the conflict. And it was given multiple opportunities to end it after the fact. But you still think the world began in 2022
The global south have the right to defend themselves from cracker expansionism. Yes, even “Russian orcs.”
Why aren’t you dropping everything and going to fight for your precious ethno-state?
Come on. Go do it. It’s a great place for Western mercenaries.
Go fight for Ukraine. Sloppa Poopani.
Ukraine has the right to defense itself, unfortunately fighting a proxy war between Russia and NATO while being the meat grinder providing soldiers is not defending yourself, Ukraine would be far better off making peace in the first year of the war itself, the longer the war continues the more gains Russia makes, Ukraine gets weaker and loses negotiation leverage for the inevitable peace treaty and the US gets more leverage to demand “rare earth minerals”, yes significant concessions will have to be made but I don’t Ukraine is gonna march on a country 5x its size anytime soon.
After the reactionary take-over spearheaded by Nazis and Banderites who worship WW2 collaborators, the burning of communists/trade-unionists in Odessa and the genocide waged against Russian speakers in the East I personally could care less that Russia does whatever is necessary to stomp the threat of a potential NATO staging ground and Nazi state in Europe.
Agreed, though. Ukraine would have been better off. We know that the United States sabotaged those talks in Istanbul though.
Well, aren’t the Ukrainian people racist toward Russians? Them letting their Russian speaking areas join Russia wouldn’t do them any bad then, would it?
Ukraine wanted them to do so, but the land should be left behind. During the 8 years of fighting from 14 to 22, one million had already fled to Russia.
Why should it be left behind? Just let it join Russia. It’s not like Ujrianains would miss Russian filled areas now would they?
Ethnic cleansing: Get rid of the people, keep the land. What I meant is that Ukraine was working to get rid of its ethnic russians, and of course wanted to keep the land.
After two rounds of shock therapy iafter 1991 and 2004, those areas (Donbas) had basically only remaining industry in Ukraine. Also the fact they Kiev starter the third round of shock looting in 2014 aimed specifically at Donbas was one of the main reasons of Donetsk and Luhansk demanding autonomy, which was rejected and both areas invaded by Kiev goons and civil war started.
What wanted back then was Ukraine staying out of NATO and the EU and autonomy rights for Donbas(meaning russian would return as one of the offical languages and no more ethnic cleansing).
Ukraine walked away from this offer. Thousands could still be alive, but “slava utini!” was more important.
They should find a way to turn their economy into a war economy; their deaths theoretically shouldn’t be eclipsing their birth rates. They may be able to find a way to make this a sustainable forever war, but they may need to institute some laws forcing families to birth multiple children.
I don’t know, I feel like if it’s managed well they should be able to sustain this war indefinitely, but they’ll need to up their birth rates; maybe turn their schools into a combination of a learning establishment and military academy?
They may be able to use this as an opportunity to get contracts to test weapons in the field, a sort of permanent real life testing ground; where other countries profit off tourism, they can profit off arms testing.
The key though behind it all is they need to seriously think about how to sustainably keep sending forces into the meat grinder, which will require lots of thought put into raising their birth rates. They’re off to a bad start for sure, but if they use their 12-18 year olds efficiently over the next ten years, they can probably get this system up and running sustainably forever going forward.
In the meantime, Europe should consider donating some of their own youth to cushion the fatality rate to give Ukraine at least a decade.
There’s a world of endless possibilities, but Ukraine needs to seriously and urgently think about mandating population controls to boost their population; they’ll never be able to sustain this fatality rate with their current birth rate, and their teenage population will only survive for so long (they certainly can’t tank as many bullets).
(I hope it doesn’t need mentioning, but this is intended as satire)
lol if this was posted on lemmy.world, the satire disclaimer would absolutely be necessary
Each family gets taxed with 2 children for the frontlines, if they have more they can avoid the frontline but need to serve on other behind frontlines military areas.
Return of the Janissaries.
I was worried until I read the last few sentences!
