Honestly thata the issue I ran into. Napster and tidal were both in the running for a minute, both were more expensive, tidal is ran by Jay z and Napster is owned by a tech bro. Honestly, I’m more inclined to go back to cd.
Its such a massive PitA to self-host things. Dont get me wrong I love the idea of it, it works in theory, and then you get an update for one of the multiple services you have to run to make it work ex-prem, or your isp does some funky stuff and drops out. There is such a massive time sink into self hosting that its not a reliable answer for 90% of people.
I use a combination of Bandcamp, Qobuz and Jellyfin atm.
It gives me the combination of using their apps or my own self hosted. The chances of everything going down at the same time is pretty slim I figured.
I also have all my purchased music stored in a Nextcloud instance so in a pinch I can play the local flac/mp3 files from my computer.
In your estimate how many hours a month do you need to upkeep all of those services? What about your power bill?
Im nitpicking because I am interested in doing something similar. Ive played with these services before but as a hobby PoC thing and not serious usage. Nextcloud I had some issues with dockerized containers, Jellyfin was nice but had its own cons. Plex has been great but I dont want to pay to access my own content on mobile.
I pay flat power bill so I don’t really know about the electricity costs. I also live a cold place so for most of the year I need to heat my apartment anyway so I don’t really know.
Apart from patching the Ubuntu VMs that run Nextcloud, Jellyfin and my Nginx proxy I haven’t had any upkeep on the services themselves after I got them setup, and even then I have automatic security updates on so I only really need to log in and run a feature update and reboot every few months.
Whenever I buy a new album I download it and put the files in their own folder in Nextcloud and everything syncs in a few minutes.
I have set up an external folder in Nextcloud for my music that is readable by Jellyfin so everything just works for now, but I’ve only had this setup for a few months to be fair.
Bandcamp and Qobuz are just apps for me and I download all the music I buy in the apps on my phone and it’s virtually no upkeep for those.
The only annoying thing is that I can’t buy music in the Qobuz app, only on the web site. I assume this is because they refuse to pay the Google tax.
You might have to look into a Wireguard/VPN setup as well if you need that for remoting into home hosting, but I can’t really help with that. I got a kinda special deal in regards of hosting.
That’s kinda the opposite of what I have found, once I get something to work it usually just works. Although I’m in IT so I’m pretty used to keeping ‘in production’ servers going.
It absolutely is more work, because you aren’t paying somebody else to do it, so you really need to decide if that’s worth it to you. For many people the trade off in control and privacy aren’t worth the extra work and paying somebody else to use their computers instead is far more convenient.
Ive worked in IT before. If things ran as smoothly as you claim, I dont think you would have much of a job. I have had a pi-hole brick itself during an update, routers crash, home PCs just stop working.
You and I have the necessary skills to accomplish what needs to be done, just the basics of reverse proxy or ssh tunnels are damn near magic to most people. Hell, could you imagine walking your tech-illiterate neighbor through the process of it all and then expect them to keep it up without contacting you all time. I can not, which, is one of the reasons why I dont work IT anymore.
For real though, I believe that self-hosting is the only future for most of what are talking about here. I thought it was the most logical next step after everyone had libraries of music and movies at home in the 90s. I had assumed most people would want to keep those and would digitize.
The process to make that happen, and the hardware, are just not accessible to others outside our field.
I would like to see a closer to all-in-one-solution become available. A system one could purchase with software ready to go all where you have to do is load it with content. Hell, call it a Spoopify Box or something equally ridiculous and you could VC angel funding in a week in SF.
Be the change you wish to see in the world, I guess. But I don’t see a commercial product like that taking off, simply because the MPAA and RIAA will fight it. They will use the media to convince the public that it is a piracy tool.
I also don’t think it’s fair to demand FOSS volunteers to cater to tech illiterates. These projects are a labor of love, not a product. Self hosting means you are taking the responsibility of hosting something, and that comes with pros and cons. I think expecting a black box solution to remain stable and secure in the long run is a hard sell for me, it doesn’t line up with my personal and professional experience.
I feel like this opinion is more damaging to the cause than most people realize. Accessibility and usability are just so important, I would never demand that the opensource community do this task as it should be a cost to consumers just not like the SASS model we are currently dealing with.
I think I would like the world to be different, I just dont know how to get there yet.
No doubt that the black box solution is out of reach as of yet, but as technology moves forward the changes become less and less of a delta and it could be possible in the future. I would like to look at this solution like we look at video game consoles, or Roku even.
I’m absolutely there on movies, even running my own jellyfin, but I listen to such a wide variety that I don’t even know where to start getting some of them in physical.
Bandcamp is where it’s at! If you are ever dissatisfied with the music industry’s proliferation of stupid and samey music, Bandcamp will surely have something for you.
Honestly thata the issue I ran into. Napster and tidal were both in the running for a minute, both were more expensive, tidal is ran by Jay z and Napster is owned by a tech bro. Honestly, I’m more inclined to go back to cd.
Its such a massive PitA to self-host things. Dont get me wrong I love the idea of it, it works in theory, and then you get an update for one of the multiple services you have to run to make it work ex-prem, or your isp does some funky stuff and drops out. There is such a massive time sink into self hosting that its not a reliable answer for 90% of people.
I use a combination of Bandcamp, Qobuz and Jellyfin atm. It gives me the combination of using their apps or my own self hosted. The chances of everything going down at the same time is pretty slim I figured.
I also have all my purchased music stored in a Nextcloud instance so in a pinch I can play the local flac/mp3 files from my computer.
In your estimate how many hours a month do you need to upkeep all of those services? What about your power bill? Im nitpicking because I am interested in doing something similar. Ive played with these services before but as a hobby PoC thing and not serious usage. Nextcloud I had some issues with dockerized containers, Jellyfin was nice but had its own cons. Plex has been great but I dont want to pay to access my own content on mobile.
I pay flat power bill so I don’t really know about the electricity costs. I also live a cold place so for most of the year I need to heat my apartment anyway so I don’t really know.
Apart from patching the Ubuntu VMs that run Nextcloud, Jellyfin and my Nginx proxy I haven’t had any upkeep on the services themselves after I got them setup, and even then I have automatic security updates on so I only really need to log in and run a feature update and reboot every few months.
Whenever I buy a new album I download it and put the files in their own folder in Nextcloud and everything syncs in a few minutes. I have set up an external folder in Nextcloud for my music that is readable by Jellyfin so everything just works for now, but I’ve only had this setup for a few months to be fair.
Bandcamp and Qobuz are just apps for me and I download all the music I buy in the apps on my phone and it’s virtually no upkeep for those. The only annoying thing is that I can’t buy music in the Qobuz app, only on the web site. I assume this is because they refuse to pay the Google tax.
You might have to look into a Wireguard/VPN setup as well if you need that for remoting into home hosting, but I can’t really help with that. I got a kinda special deal in regards of hosting.
Your setup sounds like a dream, kinda jealous of your hosting solution, gotta admit. Thanks for all the great info, youre a great person!
That’s kinda the opposite of what I have found, once I get something to work it usually just works. Although I’m in IT so I’m pretty used to keeping ‘in production’ servers going. It absolutely is more work, because you aren’t paying somebody else to do it, so you really need to decide if that’s worth it to you. For many people the trade off in control and privacy aren’t worth the extra work and paying somebody else to use their computers instead is far more convenient.
Ive worked in IT before. If things ran as smoothly as you claim, I dont think you would have much of a job. I have had a pi-hole brick itself during an update, routers crash, home PCs just stop working.
You and I have the necessary skills to accomplish what needs to be done, just the basics of reverse proxy or ssh tunnels are damn near magic to most people. Hell, could you imagine walking your tech-illiterate neighbor through the process of it all and then expect them to keep it up without contacting you all time. I can not, which, is one of the reasons why I dont work IT anymore.
For real though, I believe that self-hosting is the only future for most of what are talking about here. I thought it was the most logical next step after everyone had libraries of music and movies at home in the 90s. I had assumed most people would want to keep those and would digitize.
The process to make that happen, and the hardware, are just not accessible to others outside our field. I would like to see a closer to all-in-one-solution become available. A system one could purchase with software ready to go all where you have to do is load it with content. Hell, call it a Spoopify Box or something equally ridiculous and you could VC angel funding in a week in SF.
Be the change you wish to see in the world, I guess. But I don’t see a commercial product like that taking off, simply because the MPAA and RIAA will fight it. They will use the media to convince the public that it is a piracy tool. I also don’t think it’s fair to demand FOSS volunteers to cater to tech illiterates. These projects are a labor of love, not a product. Self hosting means you are taking the responsibility of hosting something, and that comes with pros and cons. I think expecting a black box solution to remain stable and secure in the long run is a hard sell for me, it doesn’t line up with my personal and professional experience.
I feel like this opinion is more damaging to the cause than most people realize. Accessibility and usability are just so important, I would never demand that the opensource community do this task as it should be a cost to consumers just not like the SASS model we are currently dealing with.
I think I would like the world to be different, I just dont know how to get there yet.
No doubt that the black box solution is out of reach as of yet, but as technology moves forward the changes become less and less of a delta and it could be possible in the future. I would like to look at this solution like we look at video game consoles, or Roku even.
Yep, I’ve started buying all my media again, even music. Don’t want my copy of a movie to get censored, don’t want my music to get delisted.
The only exception is games. Damn you, steam, for being so awesome in every way except ownership.
Gonna cry when gaben kicks it, they go public, and become ea 2.0. Its gonna be hell for gamers.
All we can do is fight when the time comes. Hopefully his successor has the same values as him.
I’m absolutely there on movies, even running my own jellyfin, but I listen to such a wide variety that I don’t even know where to start getting some of them in physical.
You don’t necessarily need to buy physical to own. Most of my music comes from Bandcamp in the form of FLAC and mp3, but I have CDs and vinyl as well.
Oh heck, I didn’t even know about bandcamp
Bandcamp is where it’s at! If you are ever dissatisfied with the music industry’s proliferation of stupid and samey music, Bandcamp will surely have something for you.