I’m a bit emotional right now. But in the bad way to be fair.
I just got stung by a wasp without any reason, after having to take a extensive shower before because my body was totally itchy from all the mites and whatnot. UGH! 😫

I’ve been pretty proud in the beginning of this experiment, because there were lots of wild bees, beetles and other cool critters around here. It’s basically like being in nature.

But I forgot that nature sucks… 🥲

For example, imagine laying in the grass and just chilling.
Beautiful for the first 5 seconds, but then, you begin getting stung in the asscreek by a dozen ants and get everything ruined.

Nature is basically dead in my area, so only the asshole bugs survive here.

The whole balcony is swarmed by aphids/ mites as well as ant colonies that protect those suckers from ladybugs and other beneficial predatory insects.

The aphids droop honeydew everywhere, which attracts lots of yellow jacket wasps, which in return could kill my girlfriend in minutes because she’s highly allergic.
I didn’t even realise that asshole (the wasp, lol) is there until I got stung just by existing.

I’m right about to pull the trigger and get my pesticides (neem oil/ pyrethrum extract) out.

Also, I began to hate soil even more than before.
I have to hunt for slugs every evening, because they’re everywhere, and I can barely stand a chance against them.
There are gnats living in it too, as well as other unwanted guests.

The plants in soil are starting to spread diseases and pests to my otherwise healthy plants in hydroponics. I will for example harvest my weed soon, and there are bugs sticking in the buds like in a glue trap. I have no idea how I should get them out of them, it’s just disgusting.

I also largely prefer hydro compared to soil, not only because there are less pests, but also because due to the much lower water demand and control it gives me.
The soil is guzzling water like crazy and still the plants are looking way less healthy.

Spraying neem oil on my hydro plants and just not using soil anymore seems to be the way better choice right now.

Sorry for the rant. It had to be.

What should I do?

  • TropicalDingdong@lemmy.worldEnglish
    404·
    12 days ago

    so okay a lot to unpack here

    but let’s keep in mind that “nature” isn’t sleeping beauty, it’s animals and plants all trying to get one over on one another. They don’t give a shit.

    Second, like, agriculture isn’t nature. It’s highly managed systems out of any kind of ecological context. So mixing you pot in with nasturtium? Maybe get off of tiktok for gardening advice.

    Pick: Do you want to grow plants for human products or do you want a slice of the natural world?

    If you want to grow for production, out doors indoors doesn’t matter. The name of the game is sanitation sanitation sanitation. And you can manage that in a mixed system.

    Second, your “mites” aren’t mites, they are aphids. I can’t believe I have to explain this to a weed grower. Ants will move aphids around plants, effectively using them as their own form of animal agriculture. So relying on spraying doesn’t solve the primary issue there. You will need to spray to get the superficial stuff under control if you want to, but getting the ants under control is the only real way to control the aphids. The ants are far better at spreading aphids than you are at managing them. Beat the ants and then beat the aphids.

    As far as beating the ants. Figure out what species they are first. Plenty ants will die back a bit from a chemical spray, but then come back with a vengeance a few weeks later because stress causes them to make more queens.

    What can you do? Take it all as a lesson, take some time to clear you mind about what you want to do, and give it another go after cleaning up the mess. The outdoor pot is prob unrecoverable and will be swaggy after anyways. And it’s not clear why you are growing. Figure out what you want from growing and focus on doing that effectively.

    If you want nature, that comes with slugs and wasps and ants. And mixed systems can be effective (my garden has probably a hundred different species). But it takes a long time and a lot of experience to have the knowledge to be able to identify issues early and respond appropriately for each plant in a mixed system.

    • Günther Unlustig 🍄@slrpnk.netOPEnglish
      1312·
      12 days ago

      Hey. Thanks for taking the time to write all of this.

      But I just wanna say that your comment comes off pretty hostile in my eyes. The world is already a shitty place sometimes, and I think some of your statements were just unnecessary provocative tbh.

      Regarding why I chose this kind of system: stability.

      It’s basically impossible to prevent pests outdoors, and I thought that if I just let nature take its course, it will be self regulating and I don’t have to intervene.

      Second, your “mites” aren’t mites, they are aphids. I can’t believe I have to explain this to a weed grower.

      I also said that I have both. There is lots of white, flaky stuff (probably white flies) and some mites (small webs) as well as the aphids that are more prominently pictured.

      Also, why should I be a more competent gardener only because I grow weed?
      I find it basically impossible to kill this stuff. I find melons and chilis way harder tbh.

      I already have lots of knowledge, but I lack a bit behind in terms of experience. I find zero shame in that, and maybe others face the same problem right now, but are afraid to ask because of rude comments like yours 😬

      • TropicalDingdong@lemmy.worldEnglish
        178·
        12 days ago

        You have no obligation to respond like I have not obligation to manage you for your response. If you want saccharine sweet ego fluffing responses, go prompt an AI. Being earnest and being honest are more important to me.

        I already have lots of knowledge, but I lack a bit behind in terms of experience.

        There must be a word in German for this kind of hubris. If not, we should petition for one, because in the age of tiktok and AI slop, people mistaking the sensation of understanding for themselves actually understanding something, is going to be a continuously compounding problem.

        Regarding why I chose this kind of system: stability

        So what is stable about your current system? Take the moment for some introspection. Is it stable? Or maybe are you assumptions about stability wrong? Are you expecting to permaculture on a balcony garden? Are you expecting too much because you have some misconceptions?

        What I see in your pictures are what I see all the time from novice gardeners. 20 kg of compost (shit) in a 5 kg bag.

        Plants are in constant competition with one another for resources. Both sunlight, but also root space, and also air (air flow more specifically). Go walk through a natural area and you notice that unless it’s a heavily invaded area, plants spread out. If you have a small area to work with, you are creating the exact kind of environment for the kinds of pest issues you’ve created by doing exactly what you are doing: this is self evident otherwise you wouldn’t be making this post or having these issues.

        I also said that I have both. There is lots of white, flaky stuff (probably white flies) and some mites (small webs) as well as the aphids that are more prominently pictured.

        I think my prior paragraph outlines why. You are trying to do too much with too little. Fewer plants and more spacing between them will both result in individually healthier plants and fewer disease issues because the diseases have a harder time moving through the system.

        The white flakey stuff is probably a scale insect also getting moved around by the ants. Again, manage for the ants and the scale and aphid issues will solve themselves.

        And with regards to mites, if you truly have them, burning it all down is often the only solution. It’s probably the best thing to do for you if the issues are as bad as they seem. It’s almost impossible to get rid of spider mites.

        Also, why should I be a more competent gardener only because I grow weed?

        Because what I’ve found in a few decades of growing is that marijuana growers take their craft very, very seriously. The ones who fail to develop good growing knowledge from reliable sources don’t make it.

        However, knowledge in gardening is no replacement for experience, because growing is a fundamentally place based process. There is no knowledge other than experience that can tell you how to work with this particular plant, in this particular place, at this particular time.

        And in regard to tone…

        You call me the rude one but you are the one slandering the plants and animals who are simply responding to the conditions you created. Take some responsibility.

        Here is a small section of my garden, with easily maybe a hundred different species, many native several endangered. No diseases, heavy production (3 species bananas, lemons, limes, yuzu, cacao, vanilla, kalo, lilikoi, rhubarb, eggplant, and more).

        !()[https://files.catbox.moe/yoan9e.mp4]

        Mixed systems can very much work, but don’t blame plants and animals for situations you create

        • Günther Unlustig 🍄@slrpnk.netOPEnglish
          112·
          11 days ago

          If you want saccharine sweet ego fluffing responses, go prompt an AI. Being earnest and being honest are more important to me.

          That’s why I made this post. Because maybe I needed some feedback from real people, with hands on experience, who either tried but failed, or did something a bit different and succeeded.

          I didn’t criticise what you said, it’s how you said it.
          I’m highly glad for your input, but I personally think that you could have said it a bit more friendly while being just as honest at the same time.

          There must be a word in German for this kind of hubris.

          Sure, there’s always a german word for something :D

          Right now, I can think of “Schreibtischexperte” (desktop expert), but maybe “Praxisversager” (a loser in hands-on-experience), or Theorieprofessor.

          2 out if the 3 were made up by myself just at the moment, lol.

          So what is stable about your current system? Take the moment for some introspection. Is it stable? Or maybe are you assumptions about stability wrong? Are you expecting to permaculture on a balcony garden? Are you expecting too much because you have some misconceptions?

          Stable means for me, that there aren’t zero pests, but also no overabundance.

          I think I may have overreacted a bit yesterday.
          I was already pissed about having itchy bugs everywhere on my skin, and then the wasp attack was the final nail in the coffin…

          I planted the willow there on purpose, because last year, when I went for a walk, I noticed mainly the willow trees being swarmed by pests.

          They act not only as a trellis for me, but also as a bait, so the pests are only sucking the sap of the willow and not the stuff around. And then, they attract predators, which will ward off any critters that might attack my crops.

          However, I didn’t think about the relationship between the ants and those bastards.

          If you have a small area to work with, you are creating the exact kind of environment for the kinds of pest issues you’ve created by doing exactly what you are doing

          You are trying to do too much with too little. Fewer plants and more spacing between them will both result in individually healthier plants and fewer disease issues because the diseases have a harder time moving through the system.

          I think you are absolutely right. I think some of the plants are stressed because they are overcrowded, and there isn’t sufficient light and airflow.

          I tried to experiment this year and see how much I can grow per m².
          Even though it sucks right now, I would call this experiment successful.

          I think I have learned something: More isn’t better.

          My balcony will be less crowded next year.

          Also, your garden looks cool af! 😁 Thanks for sharing the video!

          And again, thank you for all the advice :)

    • just_another_person@lemmy.worldEnglish
      1228·
      12 days ago

      Hey, buddy. Take the shade out of the comment and someone might be more willing to listen. You just j Sound like kind of a dick the way this is phrased.

      • TropicalDingdong@lemmy.worldEnglish
        2310·
        12 days ago

        Bruh you can manage your own tone however you want. No need to tone police others. You want to deliver them a lavender scented rebuttal, you go ahead and do that.

        You come in with a thoughtless rant clearly devoid of any introspection or consideration that they may be the source of their own problems, expect some salt and shade.