- cross-posted to:
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- cross-posted to:
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cross-posted from: https://piefed.blahaj.zone/c/politicalmemes/p/392491/do-you-agree
Do you agree?
cross-posted from: https://piefed.blahaj.zone/c/politicalmemes/p/392491/do-you-agree
Do you agree?
Neither the USSR or the US were good attempts imo.
They both used authoritarian tactics to shut down dissenting opinions since the very beginning.
The idea here would be bottom up power, not top down.
How do you build that though? I’m all for distributed power, I think the ideal system for this point in history is a highly federated iterative representative system starting at the neighborhood level, but that still puts larger regional power in representatives.
How do you build a system that has no authoritarian component, but can still respond to people oppressing one another? There will always be natural born sociopaths, how do you thread the needle of preventing those sociopaths from stealing, raping, murdering, etc. while not creating offices for sociopaths to abuse?
Regulating a system comes down to understanding logistic curves. I like to refer to the general concept of a justice system:
You can get the majority of your violent criminals behind bars, but the collateral damage is a lot of innocent people in there with them.
Or you can keep the majority of your innocent people out of prison, but the collateral damage is a lot of violent criminals out there with them.
You’ve got to find the acceptable middle ground between tyranny and negligence.
I think the US Legislative, Judicial, Executive system is a pretty good attempt. I think it’s probably a good framework for anything that replaces it. Obviously it needs some major tweaks, but I’ve explored most of the left side of the political spectrum and devoted a lot of time to theory-crafting, and it’s hard to come up with a more resilient basis for a system.
Sincerely I want to know, how would a system that preserves democracy look substantially different? You still need to decide on policy, you need to direct that policy, and you need to review that policy to make sure that everything is being done in accordance with the stated will of the people.
In my dreams, leftists sweep Congress and call a Constitutional Convention, and change less than you might think.
Only if they’re dynamic an instantly recallable at any moment. Why not have people represent their own interests directly, again?
That introduces its own vectors of dysfunction and abuse. What triggers a recall? How do you cope with the inherent instability when a recall can happen at any time?
And people can’t represent their own interests, most of them know nothing about the intricacies of supporting a functioning civilization. Direct democracy is a breeding ground for celebrity demagogues.
And there it is, there’s your real values.
Cool, cool. Yeah you make a good point. Tell you what, if you really want to be a slave, you can buy me a place with a basement and I’ll keep you there.
Really trying to prove people are too dumb to live, aren’t you? Can you people come up with a single problem that an anarchist solution would have that we don’t have a thousand times worse right now?
Why are you being this hostile?
Sorry, you wouldn’t understand.
Its incredibly difficult to build a country, so i think the US was about the best attempt at a working system im aware of. The issue is that we didnt quite get the message of “all men were created equal” and we basically immedietely started othering. Hence, two party system, slavery, the idea that woman deserve less for the same job, the idea that working fast food should be difficult because you follow “the right path”
Its all excuses that people use to other. And just like the paradox of tolerance, the only solution is that othering is acceptable, but only against those that would other. If you want to divide lines between people and get them to fight each other, the social contract no longer applies to you and imo your “human rights” should be revoked. Those are an agreement that you will behave societally and recieve societal protections. And you chose not to do that.
Minorities are this countries best resource. And theyre also the best group to watch, because those that would target minorities would target you if goven the chance. Prioritize all your policies around protecting minorities and what do you know, suddenly everyone is protected. Attack minorities and what do you know, civil war, political unrest, tyranny.
Edit: further clarification on my first statement: i fucking hate the US. What i meant by that was only that its easier to build a future based off our current system with massive overhauls than it would be to build an entirely new system. As a metaphor, the worst nuclear war ever would be more easy to recover from than terrforming mars.