During an interview with trans journalist and writer Izzy Dine, published online on Tuesday (21 October), the women and equalities minister was asked what bathroom she thought Dine and other trans women should currently be using.
In September, Phillipson, who is currently running the Labour deputy leadership candidacy, was handed the Equality and Human Rights Commission’s (EHRC) code of practice on single-sex services, which could result in a bathroom ban for trans people.
[…]
Asked what bathroom trans women should currently be using, Phillipson appeared unable to give a clear answer, instead simply restating the ruling, the full impact of which remains unclear: “As Minister for Women and Equalities, I set out the policies responding to the Supreme Court judgement. The Supreme Court were clear that, uh, for the purposes of the Equality Act, sex is biological sex.“What’s now happening is the Equality and Human Rights Commission have, uh, have consulted on a code of practice to me as the minister. I’ll then be going through that line by line to make sure we get that right. It’s a 300-page document so it will take some time.”
Dine then pointed to interim guidance from the EHRC, which included a clause banning trans women from men’s toilets as well as women’s. The guidance has since been repealed.
I have always thought that bathroom segregation was stupid. Design them for privacy and desegregate them. We should never have needed to have this debate.
wow, ‘trans (women) people can’t use public bathrooms’ was allowed to exist… for a while? Interesting.
Nobody should care; just wash your hands afterwards!
Seriously, my gamer friend who never leaves his house seems to be SO concerned about what bathrooms people use and was so incensed about it.
This person is your ‘friend’? Sus
lol, he’s actually a very good friend of mine. I went back to the UK and needed a place to stay and we linked up.
He got me into Expedition 33, Aliens, Fallout and quite a few other things.
We chatted about our old boss who I hated but he loved. Mainly because that old boss screwed me over but felt guilty about and treated people like him better to make up for it. Anyways, that boss has a few kids and one of those kids around 11 or so was wondering if he was the right gender. That incensed that boss and him and my friend would get into discussions about this apparently.
So he said one day about: “there are only two genders in the world”. I was like, “wait, what? what are you talking about”. Then it went into … why do people get pissed off when I say there’s just two genders. Then I had to say, I think you mean sex … but you know there are intersex people right? Then he’s like, “yes”. Then I’m like, “so … what are we talking about …?” … then we got into it a bit and I basically said, “this bathroom shit has caused no problems so far, who honestly cares … and if anything I’ve read stories about cis-women being attacked because idiots think they’re transgender which is all sorts of fucked up”
I have a lot of people that I consider friends and you sorta don’t find out what weird stuff they believe until over time. Like my cousin who I love is a Musk fan and that fucking drives me nuts. Also, if I consider them friends I’m not gonna just cut people out of my life (depending). If they just believe something dumb, I’d rather slow burn their beliefs away.
I was in a big multi-user unisex bathroom type of situation for the first time in my life the other day, in a shopping centre. I thought nothing of it until a couple members of the opposite sex walked in while I was there, and decades of training made me think for a moment that someone was in the wrong place. That feeling must be why it’s such a big political issue. Took me at least ten seconds to get over it.
Woah ten seconds what the hell. Gotta pass actual laws to prevent that
That feeling must be why it’s such a big political issue.
That’s quite possible. When you consider other things that has people clutching their pearls, it kind of all boils down to “someone made me feel something strongly, and I wasn’t prepared for it.” As someone who profoundly dislikes being jump-scared, I kind of get it, but that doesn’t justify a cruel or violent response. That’s the part I’m having a hard time figuring out.
Normal people get startled once maybe twice by a new thing, then adapt to it. Transphobes make their fear their entire personality.
For Halloween, people should dress up as trans women and beat up conservatives getting boners to make them even more afraid and confused. Let’s really cement that transphobia.
Yeah, the first couple times I felt confused/surprised, but these bathrooms are so much better - the ones I’ve been in have had the most excellent stalls.
The supreme court also didnt mention toilets. Not once.
Given unisex toilets exist, in some shopping centers etc., how can it be proportionate to ban trans men or women from other toilets? Makes no sense to me.
Search for toilet here https://iandunt.substack.com/p/everything-you-need-to-know-about
While I fully agree with who cares.
On an entirely logical basis. The existence of unisex toilets is not an arguement against others interpretation. It’s entirely a labelling issue. Most homes have unisex toilets as well. No oneusing them has any expectations of gender use.
While those arguing against trans use. Logically (although not morraly or scientifically) have an argument that the room is labelled to limit sex if not gender.
Personally I think all public toilets should be unisex. It has multiple advantages.
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cubical provide privacy. And in a world where sexual orientation is accepted. Considering privacy an entirely gender related issue is overtly Victorian as an idealism.
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Ignoring the lack of evidence of men possing as trans to attack women in a single sex bathroom. Such a threat if it existed would only be unique to such areas due to the lack of expectations of male use. Having both sexes expecting to use the room. And to provide each other with privacy and respect. would provide normal public oversight on any activities.
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All gender users should be more likely to have a desire to show an attitude of minimal cleanliness. The use and abuse of single sex public bathrooms, both male and female. Seems to be a unique behaivior invoked when people do not expect to be judged by the opposite sex.
And yet there was some legislation (to be fair, I think it was when the Tories were still in charge) which was trying to remove gender neutral facilities from (workplaces? Local government? Can’t remember)
I’m not too surprised by that. Personally, I’ve found lavatories/bathrooms to be pointlessly gendered. Unless, of course, one considers gender as a part of a social hierarchy (e.g. patriarchy), then it becomes a simple matter of segregation.
Personally I think it is a Victorian idealism. As in the common refusal to accept same sex relationships existed.
The whole idea of separating sex somehow providing privacy. Completely misses the point. While also allowing reduced funding in care and provision of bathroom spaces.
As such while almost every other issue has been discussed or addressed at some point by politicians. The idea that all bathroom and change spaces should be privacy provisioned to allow all genders to share with no embarrassment at all. Has been ignored as an inconvenience not worth addressing.
I remember small groups of terf MPs calling for legislation. But no legislation actually being pushed in parliament. I’ll search when I have time. As an older fart my memory may be going ;).
The only interpretation im considering is the supreme courts. By theirs, the concept of a biological sex defined space for toilets doesnt work.
Agreed. But the court dose not make laws. They only get to interpret it.
Be sure to remember it is parliament that can and must fix this. Unfortunately laws will and always have been written in the accepted Lang and ideals of the time. As such they will always need updating to pass evolving ideals.
Unfortunately that has always taken effort from the public to sell and force politicians and in evolved arseholes to accept changes are needed.
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I have some sympathy with Phillipson here, the current guidance is an absolute shit show and whatever she says she’ll get shit from transpeople, or from terfs.
But that all said, be better.
Don’t feel bad for her. She wants this. She appointed Mary-Ann Stephenson, a terf, as the next EHRC head despite objections from parliamentary committees.
transpeopleis dehumanizing.“Trans people” and “cis people.” Otherwise it reads like, “blarglepeople” and “actual people.”
The mashing together of the words was the language of the early anti-trans propaganda. It was successful enough that even allies continue to use it, unfortunately. Mostly because they’ve come up with new and worse ways to deny our existence while specifically addressing us.
I would say that it feels like blowing into the wind, but I know things like this can change, especially if 'teh youth" get it.
Politicians have ducked their responsibilities here. Once the court ruled their unworkable interpretation of the law they should have gone back to the drawing board and passed new clearer legislation.
What they need to do is fix the Equality Act.
Exactly this. The job of parliament is to maintain and update laws as society understanding changes.
Refusing to address an issue because a tiny paranoid section of society is scared with zero evidence of the risk they fear. Is just refusing to do that job.
But (and ,oat know this but it needs pointing out.) younger people not voting allows politicians to delay addressing issues. Hence why so many laws have taken so long to change.
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Get fucked, cunt.
It’s a room we go to shit in, you miserable fuck.
Honestly, the worst part about this reply is how fucking lazy it is. Trolls used to put some effort in, this is just pathetic and cringe. When did trolls just become boring?
We overfed them
Maybe you should be the toilet.
You woke up a two year old account to be a fucking asshole, lmao.
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