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That was how Germany lost its leading position in science in the 1930ies. It was not only Einstein but loads of world-renonwned scientists which emigrated. It even marked the end of German as a common language for top-level science publication.
16000 more project proposals this year, but have they increased the pay of those having to approve them? Nope 😭
Operation Pilcrepap
If they’d like engineers as well, I’m ready to go too.
Hello, US born engineer with only US passport, but I now live in Denmark working. Happy to answer any questions you have on it.
The super short is that it’s been tough but very rewarding. We left before the last election so it wasn’t specifically to run away from trump but that’s kinda part of the idea lol
If you are experienced and you accept EU salaries in exchange for a social system, you should be able to make it.
Ah, I’m about to graduate. Not much prior experience. Damn.
Cern was looking for graduates a while back.
It’s hard to immigrate on a pro visa without experience. Companies are generally accepting to take the risk because you bring skills and experience that are hard to recruit locally, such as senior engineers. If you are still studying, another solution is to pass an additional diploma in EU. A EU diploma will be a strong advantage to stay.
What’s the expected cost? (Not counting food and housing)
Depends on the country and uni, but generally lower than the US, 6-8k EUR per semester for people from outside the EU.
Hmm… I think the play may be to stay in the US a little bit longer to build up reserve funds, then try to apply for a visa to make that happen. Hopefully I can stay safe-ish till then.
(Bit of a funny sidenote, that cost is comically lower compared to my current tuition. My current per-quarter tuition is roughly double that, ~15k USD)
In some countries it’s almost free. EPF schools in Switzerland for example are something like 600$ per semester. You only have to pay for some administrative stuff.
But of course you have to pay to live outside of school and that’s where the fun begins 🤷🏻♂️
We have two semester per year, do I assume correctly that your cost per quarter is paid 2-3 times per year? If so, damn.
Just to add: Germany (and probably other countries, but I’m not familiar) also has a special job type “working student” with some tax and insurance benefits (usually net pay after health insurance of a little under 1000€/month for a 20hr week), which is also a good way to gain experience while under a student visa and in the best case switch to full time employment at the same company (or another one, where you would then at least have some experience working in the country already). We have a few students from outside the EU in my company that are doing/did exactly that.
Of course those jobs don’t grow on trees either, but it’s a thing that to my knowledge doesn’t have an equivalent in the US. Hiring students is much cheaper for companies so quite a few are searching in spite of the low hours (20/week is the legal limit) and usually no experience.
Come to Czechia! I am working in an academic institute at my Uni. Besides experienced candidates we sometimes take students and post graduates (local and international) and we are always short on engineers. Pay is not much but the health and social benefits are worth it for a start. This is probably applicable in any EU state, more developed countries than Czech Republic will have higher salaries, higher living standards (ie Germany, Netherlands, France, etc) but also more expensive services.
Tl;dr: in EU you can work in academia, you get standard employment benefits, but “government” pay, still worth it tho
Expect to make much less than in the US, too.
You might want to looking at your ancestry. Many European countries have citizenship by descent. Given that many Americans are originally at least partly from Europe, you might find that you are actually a European citizen.
How do you do this?
My grandparents are dead. Died before I was even born. Parents are maga so that’s a nonstarter
It depends on the country, but you need to be able to proof, that your ancestors were citizens of the country and a paper trail proving that you are indeed a descendend of them. So basically figure out where your family is from, what the countries laws are in respect to citizenship by descent and then find the documents showing your relation have them in the right form(translated and approved) and then hand that in. Again the process differes between countries and you might have to talk with your parents to get some of those documents.
And as the US deteriorates, these programs will likely be the first to be curtailed.
I have people who have been refugees in my family - they’ll tell you being early is much better than being late.
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… I actually fail from both sides. Without revealing personal history, let’s just say I know one side of my family is not from Europe, and the other one is best described as “unknown, but fragmented enough that the answer is unlikely”.
As far as I know, engineers are desperately sought after in Germany, for example. On the “Make it in Germany” website, the Federal Ministry for Economic Affairs and Energy has a section with information for engineers.
Engineers also seem to be in demand in other European countries.
Maybe you’ll find something with us – fingers crossed.
What? My brother as an engineer spent almost a whole year job hunting in Germany. The current market is bad, with the car manufacturers (and their supply chain) kicking Out people left and right.
It is currently very difficult to find good engineering jobs in Germany.
Then a lot must have changed in recent years. I can’t judge that myself; I just kind of regularly see reports that demand for engineers is high, but I’m probably not up to date with the latest information.
Yes a lot has changed in the last 2 years alone.
The auto industry is having a hard time with the transition to EVs. They’ve become very polished at building internal combustion engines and very slow to pivot. Now all that expertise needs to be ditched.
German cars only look polished. This is the industry that started using plastic engine parts with designed fail times.
You know Europe is like, five steps behind the US, right? The “we’re still not legally allowed to call ourselves Nazi” party is winning in Germany, the continent keeps trying to make privacy illegal, and I’m pretty sure Italy already is fascist again.
And yet that is still miles away from whatever is happening in the US. You are aware of that, right?
I assume that’s what he meant with the “five steps behind”. As in, not worse, but heading the same direction.
I am an European, but I have to digress he kind of has a point (even though it was unnecesiarly condescending). It’s definitely nowhere near as bad as in the US, and I think our political systems are a little bit more resistant to it than in the US, but alt-right rhetorics and parties are picking up way faster than I’d like.
I mean, Slovakia is a recent and pretty terryfiing example.
Which means we still have five chances to change course before ending up where the US is?
Facts are not wrong but analysis is
I’ll take the easy bait.
Are you saying EU is five steps behind the USA in terms of privacy and other social protections? I thought it was the opposite, there’s already a far right wannabe king in the USA, weak privacy laws and weak social system that keeps getting dismantled by the current government.
Let me know why you think the opposite.“five steps behind” meaning they’re heading the same direction and almost as far along.
I see, well then it remains five steps better so far and there are not many better alternatives.
Well sir, abandon your homeland if you must rather than stay and fight. But know this: I’ve never implemented a temporary solution I didn’t come to regret.
You can abandon it temporarily to learn different ways and bring this experience back to better contribute to your country later. Sometimes it’s a matter of danger for your life and relatives too, if your group is getting targeted by the regime.
Don’t known why you’re being down voted. Things are bad in Europe. Economy is bad, xenophobia and extremism, cost of living. In a few countries there’s already crackdowns on freedom of speech. On top of that there’s crazy tensions with Russia.
Its true that culture is great and quality of life is very good if you can afford it but that’s getting out of reach for more and more people.
US has way more advantages. Better to fight to keep your system and make it work.
I don’t know if you’ve noticed, but almost every bad thing you mentioned for Europe also applies to the US, and in some cases even in more extreme ways. The only one that doesn’t apply is the tensions with Russia because all Putin needs to do it talk some sweet talk and Trump with kiss his feet.
What’s the other person is saying is “Don’t go living in that dumpster, it smells. Stay here in my dumpster that also smells but is also on fire.” It fucking sucks everywhere but I’m not going to fault anyone for wanting to get away from the fascist hellscape that is the US.
What more advantages does the US have if you’re not rich?
Additional context:
The program mentioned in the news is the ERC Advanced Grant. This is a grant for established PIs (professors, mostly) across all research fields and gives a shit ton of research funding… up to 2.5M EUR in five years (which looks like they’d give more for relocation?). I personally find increasing ERC funding a great thing to do, but this is in no way for normal ppl with normal careers lol, it’s literally for “top researchers”
I’m surprised they didn’t mention the record number of applicants for the Marie-Curie Postdoctoral Fellowship though. MSCA PF is specifically for non-European fresh PhD grads and new postdocs (so not quite top researchers, but close) who come to EU/EEA for work and vice-versa. They saw a record number of 17,058 proposals… +64.6% increase from 2024. Among this, only +17.1% (+181) for EU outbound, but a whopping +70.1% (+6,517) for inbound. I thought the MSCA numbers tells this story much clearer. Also fun fact, the MSCA PF funding pool got a -3.1% slight reduction despite the massive increase in submitted proposals… but anyways here is the 2024 report for scale
Thanks that brings a better perspective indeed!
how ironic that during the 90s people were leaving europe for the fuarking US. my gramps would be rolling in his grave seeing this.
The collective rolling our great grandfather’s are doing could power the United States.
Literally died fighting the Nazis and yet here we are…
Isn’t most of Europe turning facist too? I’m genuinely asking because American media is reporting that Europe is becoming facist too.
European here. There are many countries in Europe and some are more right leaning than others. Overall, there was a growth in the right wing (commonly mentioned as far-right) on what seems mostly against immigration. Except for Hungary, we are far from fascism. We could end up with fascism as well, but not for now
Not really. While there’s a concerning swing to nationalism, that also ignores just how much of an outlier the US is in both nationalism and economics.
